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The Illicit Recording Debate |
Participant's text
Jeff Preston being quoted by a participant
[ Jeff Preston's response ]
Date: Sat, 31 May 1997 04:28:57 -0400 From: [ Participant 1 ] Subject: To My #1 Favorite Guitarist, Allan Holdsworth Dear Allan: Your website moderator, Jeff Preston, invited me [Participant #1] to ask your thoughts, feelings, and, ultimately, permission to make personal recordings of your performances that occur in a LIVE! setting. In our correspondence (or in a public forum like the UK website) he seemed to "enlist" me to attempt to make the case for why I want to tape your band.
[ My point being that if you are going to do it, you should make an effort to seek permission. I think there is only one way you can make these recordings "right" -- and that is to get Allan' permission. Outside of that, it's wrong, IMO, since you are receiving something of value from someone that you could not have otherwise received. Since that value could not exist without the person *creating* that value, it is wrong to dismiss the idea that that person should have some say in how that value is put to use. ]
Many reasons could be expressed for the desire to tape and the desire to not be taped. Without "going-on" the way some have done on these discussions, I simply would like to ask your permission, in a respectful manner, on the basis that I believe every moment it is possible to get you on tape is a deeply worthwhile moment in Musical Enjoyment. I have strongly-held beliefs about this and I've heard you have them as well. I happen to own numerous copies of all your albums and basically I feel that your LIVE! playing is too important to let one show go by without recording for posterity (and for ongoing enjoyment throughout the year). I am truly interested in your disposition of this matter. Please reply when you get the opportunity on [ phone number ]. Additionally, should you grant any kind of limited recording like this, I would like to offer my services in collecting your royalties due you for each recording ever sold (that is, each recording ever made since people started taping you and selling them at trade shows). I am in a position (or near enough) in which I could easily exert pressure in the community of tape traders in establishing a royalty fund on the honor system. These tapes are bought regularly at weekend record shows, and I believe that you deserve as much of a percentage as you are due in the sale of these tapes. Granted, it's an inferior system, but I'm offering to implement it and send all royalties collected to you or your management (whatever the terms you deem fit). Dear Jeff: Publish this if you wish but dont publish my home phone number. Also, if you feel the end of the letter, beginning with "Additionally", doesn't belong then dont publish it either. [ "Participant 1" ]
Participant's text
Jeff Preston being quoted by a participant
[ Jeff Preston's response ]
Date: Mon, 02 Jun 1997 21:46:43 -0400 From: [ "Participant 2" ] Subject: [ omitted ] Dear everybody: First, let me say that this whole censorship "stuff" is stupid. This forum is obviously just an exercise of one person's nihilism. Jeff, if your going to put up such a forum, have the balls to let it exist.
[ Hey, if you don't like the rules, tough. You can find a soapbox to call your own -- and I'll even be there to toss tomatoes. :) As it is, what I have "the balls" to do, is to refuse to let a mob mentality sway me to do something which a friend of mine considers injurous. You think I don't know what an unpopular position mine is? Sheesh! The point being that I DON'T CARE if you don't like it -- this is the way it is *here*, and you're welcome to find somewhere else to play if this doesn't suit you. *I* am NOT OBLIGATED to yield *my* podium in the middle of The Mother Of All Podium Warehouses. I guess you'll next be trying to say that I'm to blame for all those unpublished letters you've sent to the music magazines, too. You make it sound like EVERYBODY *owes* you something (Well, at least Allan and me -- me, the right to let you help hook up bootlegs with listeners, and vice-versa, and; Allan, of course, owes you live recordings). I'd like to know what noble deed you've done for either one of us to display such ungracious audacity. ]
How can one discuss bootlegs if you can't talk about the "what, when, and where" of the bootleg. It's pointless. I think I'll demonstrate my point: ------------------------------------------------------------------------ [ Illicit recording ], called [ title ], is of a [ reference to date and place ] date. [ Musician ] is there and [ performs ] on most of the tunes. Their is an excellent drum solo by [ musician ], as well as excellent bass playing by [ musician ]. This is a classic must-have recording. This is without question even though I'm the drummer guy that first made derogatory comments about that drummer on the current AH CD, and made comments about the "Dark Side of the Moon" guitarist. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Let's see how much "Big Brother Preston" censors out of that! I'm going to personally start a listserv of my own with no holds barred. I hate censorship of any kind.
[ I'd be happy to debate this topic anywhere you like. Send me the address to your listserv when you get it going. But I have to say that you have yet to show any reason why you think your right to hear bootlegs supercedes Allan Holdsworth's right to control over his work -- all you have done is attack me, and the way I run Atavachron. Obviously, you're more comfortable with talking about what's right and wrong in regards to running an Internet forum than you are in discussing the right and wrong of bootlegging. You've found a great strawman -- all you need now is a tin man and a lion, and you'll be off to see the Wizard, Dorothy. :) ]
Participant's text
Jeff Preston being quoted by a participant
[ Jeff Preston's response ]
Date: Sat, 07 Jun 1997 03:03:32 -0500
From: [ "Participant 3" ]
Subject: "THE DEBATE"
Hello All,
Rather than participate in this silly "debate", I {"participant #
??}, have decided to donate $1 to the, "people who have way too much
free time on their hands and need to get a life" charity, every time I
listen to {insert any "illicit" AH recording here} . Peace.
[ That would certainly be much easier than explaining why you feel you have a right to continue doing something which Allan Holdsworth considers injurous. It is no surprise to me that 2 out of 3 participants to the forum thusfar have been more concerned with making personal attacks on me than they are in examining their own selfish, cowardly actions. It's the easy way out -- it's obvious that they are unable to make a case for their rights to *have* bootlegs (other than to chant, "Everyone does it, so I should too!" or, "Holdsworth *owes* me live recordings -- I'm his biggest fan!"), since Allan Holdsworth's rights supercede theirs, in regards to his work, whether enforceable or not. They know they are doing something wrong, but since it makes them feel good, they assert that it's ridiculous to afford Allan Holdsworth any respect in regards to his work. They won't explain why they won't ask Allan Holdsworth's permission to do this... why they simply disregard his wishes altogether, and ignore the fact that without his being there to play, there would be none of his music to enjoy (or in the case of bootlegging, to misappropriate). You may think this is the height of fandom, but it's absolutely scraping the bottom of the friendship barrel. It's taking advantage of someone because they have little power to stop you. You can hardly claim to hold any respect for Allan Holdsworth as a human being. Maybe as an exploitable resource, but not as a person. ]
Anil Prasad (interviewing Allan Holdsworth)
[ Just to put things in perspective, I thought I would take the opportunity to quote from Anil Prasad's 1993 interview with Allan Holdsworth, in order to provide everyone with Allan's own unambiguous words with regards to bootlegs:
What other unauthorized releases are out there?
Oh, there's tons of them, tons of them. There was one that was a live radio broadcast Ð it was just a broadcast. It wasn't supposed to be a record! They made that into a record. We did one album as a group with John Stevens, Jeff Kline and Jeff Young and it wasn't very good. But everyone agreed and said "Okay, use those tracks." But what happened is that guy went back again and took everything else we had done that day, including everything nobody wanted, and released that as well. It's almost like you can't leave anything around for anyone man, or they'll use it!
What was that called?
It was called Touching On I think.
And that was released as an album under your name?
Yeah, it started out as a group. But now the same album has my name on top. So, I'd have to say that is the most frustrating thing of all. To be in a position where you're trying to survive and keep some quality and be true to what you believe is good and try to get record deals and then to have people do that kind of stuff is pretty low. Unfortunately, they take advantage of the fact that there are people out there that will buy it and they know we're so small we can't do anything about it to stop them. Nobody can do that to Madonna or Michael Jackson, because the record company would just crucify whoever it was. There would be no way they could ever do that. But when you're in a little Mickey Mouse situation like we are, you don't make enough money to stop people from stealing stuff from you.
I didn't realize the extent you were affected by things like this.
It's my biggest nightmare, yeah.