Content-length: 160362
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Atavachron Digest - The Allan Holdsworth Discussion Digest
Number 149
Monday, 1 May 1995
TODAY'S TOPICS:
==============
Roland Video
Allan Holdsworth-Some Old (Very) History
Allan at the helm...
The latest threads
Re: Atavachron Digest Number 148
Conversation Piece?
Clarification
RE: Elitist
Harness ordering information / Amazing SynthAxe story
Re: Harness ordering information / Amazing SynthAxe story
Re: Amazing SynthAxe story
Updated Harness order info
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 1995 03:52:55 -0400
From: RJuster@aol.com
Subject: Roland Video
I finally got a chance to look at the Roland demo video. AH appears at the
very end, doing a very abridged version of Proto Cosmos. I certainly would
not reccomend this unless you're interested in Roland stuff. (Roland has a
new guitar synth-- which they say is not a synth--that has some unusual
features). BTW, there's a fine performance of Proto Cosmos on the CD that
comes with the Just For The Curious Book.--Randy
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 1995 22:26:09 -0700
From: marksg@ix.netcom.com (Mark S. Garbin)
Subject: Allan Holdsworth-Some Old (Very) History
>From 1972 to 1979 I was a radio announcer in Washington DC for a
station that, I've been told, is ledgendary in the non-commercial
world. That its call letters and license are no longer in existence I
suppose adds to the "image".
During my stint on the air, I had a show called "Tea Time" and played a
curious mixture of English progressive rock(remember that term?!) and
what was called fusion.
I have on old reel to reel tape interviews of some of today's great
musicians who graced my studio: Tom Scott, Lee Ritenour, Joe Zawinul
and, more to the point, Tony Williams.
The Tony Williams album with both Alan Pasqua and Allan Holdsworth was
superb. I remember asking a coked out Williams in an interview on the
air about Holdsworth and he was embarrassed to talk about his young
discovery. That night at the Childe Harolde club in Washington, DC I
learned why. Holdsworth blew everyone away. Williams was no match for
this virtuoso. I managed to get and still have a copy of Velvet
Darkness and wish it was available on CD.
Allan's creativity is courageous. He is a seminal influence on many
young guitarists today as I have learned from musicians in LA whom I
still count as friends.
I have also seen Allan when he was, musically, a fish out of water
namely the lead guitarist for Level 42 at the Hammersmith Odeon in
London late 1990. The combination of Mark King and his ego strutting
on stage combined with a terrible sound mix which made Allan's guitar
sound like an eggbeater was, I'm sure painful to Allan (You could see
it on stage almost like "Is the money worth it?) Is that where he and
Gary Husband met?
Ironically, one of the musicians in LA I used to see frequently was Rob
Mullins. Rob's drummer used to be Joel Taylor who I learned from your
Internet newsletter subs for Gary Husband.
As a lifelong Allan Holdsworth fan I commend you for spreading the word
and look forward to Allan's tour.
Best Regards,
marksg@ix.netcom.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 1995 15:05:32 -0400
From: RickerRA@aol.com
Subject: Allan at the helm...
It's a knob job -- and Allan does it remarkably well. I'm talking about his
engineering/producing talents. I love the sound that Allan achieves at the
Brewery. And while I imagine his recording equipment is good, I can only
guess that Allan is getting more out of less equipment than many studios are
equipped with.
With such talent and apparent passion for quality recording, I have often
wondered why Allan doesn't supplement his income with this type work more
often than he does.
What do the rest of you think of Allan's engineering/producing?
On a somewhat related note, I was trying to track down an article from
Stereophile written by the hilarious Corey Greenberg a couple of years back.
The article describes Allan's reaction to first seeing some very small tube
amps made by VTL. Does anyone know which issue that was, and if AH still
uses these amps?
On an unrelated note...
I'm sure it's been suggested before, and I always hesitate to suggest
increased commercialization of the net, but...
Is there anyway Allan could market some fan type merchandise on Atavachron?
Anything from signed CDs to (and I'm dreaming now) a CD of unreleased or
alternate mixes of AH's material...
Reed Ricker
rickerra@aol.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 1995 15:10:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andre LaFosse
Subject: The latest threads
Re: Holdsworth's direct access to the net
The issue of celebrity (for lack of a better term) involvement with the
lists that exist to document them is an interesting one, which has been
handled in a number of different ways. Most of the lists I've seen which
cover specific artists have recieved some sort of direct contact or
acknowledgement from the people in question; the David Torn and King
Crimson lists, for example, get a fairly regular amount of traffic from
either the musicians themselves or (more frequently) their professional
associates and management teams.
At the moment, it seems to me that the Atavachron list is already very
close to having a direct Internet link to Holdsworth, between Claire's
frequent updates and Chris Hoard's "eyewitness" accounts. Given
Holdsworth's well-documented embarassment at the accolades that his fans
tend to heap upon him, it's no wonder that he wouldn't want to oversee the
list himself. And I think everyone on this list knows just how easily the
Internet can eat up time before you know it. Time to kill, so far as I can
gather, is not something Holdsworth has in great abundance.
And with all due respect to the man himself, it seems to me (as Anil
Prasad pointed out in his interview with Allan a couple of years ago) that
Holdsworth isn't really keen on trying to express himself verbally (hell,
the first thing he says on his instructional tape is, "Hello. I never
really wanted to do a video, because I never felt that what I had to say
would be of much use or interest to anyone..."). I don't think he'd
relish the idea of spending his hours trying to answer electronic fan
mail, and I'd just as soon not see this list move towards a forum for
readers flooding Holdsworth with a lot of musicological and philosophical
ponderings. (After all, there are already over 300 readers on this list
to do that with).
Re: David Gilmore
I saw the David Torn/Trilok Gurtu show in Los Angeles, and I found
Gilmore's work to be very competent and appropriate to the music, but
certainly nothing terribly noteworthy. Perhaps he was at a disadvantage,
seeing as how he went on stage immediately after one of the more
distinctive guitaristic voices to have emerged in recent memory, but
Gilmore's playing struck me as being pretty generic. I have the same
comments regarding the first Lost Tribe album, on which he also appears
-- all very capable musicianship, all very well played, but for the most
part, nothing that's particularly memorable to my ears.
Then again, it would be hard for anyone to not be upstaged by Trilok --
the man was utterly astounding. My comments regarding Gilmore hold true
for the rest of Trilok's band; it was very tightly played, and never
inappropriate for the music, but none of them approached the level of
individuality or distinctiveness displayed by Trilok or Torn.
Re: Allan doing a hard rock album
"Hard rock" can mean anything from Guns N' Roses and AC/DC to Living
Colour (R.I.P.) and Soundgarden, which is to say that it has room for both
considerable progressive innovation and mind-bogglingly simplistic
traditionalism. My advice would be to not hold your breath for a
Holdsworth Heavy Metal Revue, since every indication I get is that Allan
is after an altogether more refined, ethereal, less *grating* sound than
most hard rock (or rock in general). Besides, there are certainly bits
from his earlier work -- "Hazard Profile Pt. 1," "Road Games," "Metal
Fatigue," and what have you -- that touch on a grittier aesthetic. And
while I can agree that the sound of a Holdsworthian compositional and
guitaristic aesthetic married to a hard rock instrumentation could be very
impressive, everything I've heard and read by the man indicates that he
doesn't hear his own music in that manner.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 1995 22:28:53 +1000 (EST)
From: Roger Douglas
Subject: Re: Atavachron Digest Number 148
> From: uchima@fncrd8.fnal.gov (Mike Uchima)
> Subject: Re: the unknown David Gilmour
>
> Malcolm Humes wrote:
> > followed by Trilok Gurtu's band. There's been some mention on
> > Usenet recently of Gilmour asking he's the Floyd dude. Nope. But
> > he was the standout of the Gurtu set for me aside from Trilok's
> > amazing percussion.
> Yeah, and the fact that he played the entire time squatting on the floor made
> it even *more* amazing. Does he always do that? Really neat interplay
> between Gurtu and the keyboard player too...
>
And does he still do that amazing stuff where he dips gongs into water?
The effect is almost melodic. I saw him here in Sydney a few years back
with John Mclaughlin and was totally amazed. And yes, he did squat on the
floor. I also was impressed by his sensitivity and the subtle
interchange between him and John McL and the bass player. Their album
Que Allegria is one of my favourites.
It would be extremely interesting to hear AH play with Trilok - his
approach seems so different from other drummers, though maybe what I have
heard is influenced by his playing against McLaughlin's essentially acoustic
sound. I think it might be a remarkable combination.
I've booked my table at the Basement for Allan's gig on the 10th, and
really looking forward to it. Thanks for the advance notice of the dates,
Jeff.
Roger
=====
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 1995 18:11:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andre LaFosse
Subject: Conversation Piece?
I post this with great reluctance, since I seem to recall it was the
subject of very recent discussion on the list, but I've checked the last
few back-issues and can't find mention of it. Therefore, forgive me if
I'm beating a dead horse which everyone else has just gladly attempted to
forget about, but...
*gulp*
I was was in a record store the other day and saw a copy of the album
"Conversation Piece," with Holdsworth and three other musicians, whose
names escape me. Can anyone describe this disc? What's it like, when
was it recorded, who are the other personnel...
Thanks for the help, and many apologies if I've somehow missed recent
discussion on it.
--Andre
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "ToddM"
Date: 1 May 1995 10:03:12CST6CDT
Subject: Clarification
Bleargh. There was some confusion here:
> To the one who refered to Allen's "duo" with Jeff Watson; The song he did this
> with is called "Play That Funky Music". You will find it on "Guitar Player's"
> music album.
Not Guitar Player Magazine. You mean Guitar for the Practicing Musician
Magazine. The "Guitar's Practicing Musicians Volume I" CD contains a cover
of the disco tune "Play that Funky Music" indeed with Allan and Jeff Watson
blazing away. The bassist was Randy Coven.
HOWEVER, there was another collaboration on Jeff's "Lone Ranger" CD that
was also placed on one of the Legato "Guitar on the Edge" compilations. It's
quite a good piece of music with Steve Smith on drums. On the same "Lone
Ranger" CD there was a tuneful collaboration with Steve Morse, too.
> Allen also also did some "heavy" stuff with Chic Corea on
> Shrapnel Records called The Truth In Shred.
This CD was not on Shrapnel Records, it is on Legato Records and is called
"MVP: Truth in Shredding" and Chick Corea does not play on it. It's more of
a jazz/funk outing, worth getting if you're a Holdsworth fanatic.
ToddM@laserm.lmt.com
Todd Madson - Associate Technician
LaserMaster Technical Support Services
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 1 May 95 11:25 EST
From: David.Motes@emc2-tao.fisc.com
Subject: RE: Elitist
>
> I didn't intend to disparage hard rock, rather the idea that AH should work
> that area. I love the man's music, just as it is - I think the tighter rhyth
> and simpler harmonies of hard rock would prove restrictive, reducing the
> moments of inspiration that we all love in AH's work.
>
If you want to hear AH in a hard rock setting you should get the
first TEMPEST release. It is one of the great hard rock albums of
all time (depending on whether you like Paul Williams vocals or not :-))
It also has my favorite example of AH's violin work.
David
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 1 May 1995 14:32:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: Harness ordering information / Amazing SynthAxe story
For everyone who was wanting ordering info for the Harness (Allan's
new, individually-crafted reactive load device), here's the address
for orders:
Allan Holdsworth
c/o Guitars West
1099 San Marcos Blvd.
San Marcos, Ca. 92069.
The price is $399 each, and checks should be made out to Allan
Holdsworth, for the time being. Claire said he is in the process of
setting up a company for the whole thing, so this information may
change in the near future -- I will update that info when it becomes
available.
Amazing SynthAxe story...
Claire responded to a question I had about the new Roland device
that he demonstarted at the Anaheim NAMM show a few months ago --
namely, was he taking it on tour? She said that oddly enough, he
hasn't heard from Roland since then, and he no longer has the unit
in question. However, she went on to say that he had acquired another
SynthAxe. It seem that one of the members of Stone Temple Pilots
lives in the San Diego area, and heard about the theft of his last
SynthAxe controller back in November. So, Stone Temple Pilots
BOUGHT Allan another one! Since we are all ultimately the
beneficiaries of this outstanding philanthropic gesture, I propose
that we come up with a note of appreciation to send to the members
of Stone Temple Pilots -- can someone get me an address?
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 1 May 95 14:58:48 EDT
From: jveatc01@eng.eds.com (Jef Veatch)
Subject: Re: Harness ordering information / Amazing SynthAxe story
: Claire responded to a question I had about the new Roland device
: that he demonstarted at the Anaheim NAMM show a few months ago --
: namely, was he taking it on tour? She said that oddly enough, he
: hasn't heard from Roland since then, and he no longer has the unit
: in question. However, she went on to say that he had acquired another
: SynthAxe. It seem that one of the members of Stone Temple Pilots
: lives in the San Diego area, and heard about the theft of his last
: SynthAxe controller back in November. So, Stone Temple Pilots
: BOUGHT Allan another one! Since we are all ultimately the
: beneficiaries of this outstanding philanthropic gesture, I propose
: that we come up with a note of appreciation to send to the members
: of Stone Temple Pilots -- can someone get me an address?
:
Too cool. I sorta' liked STP before. I suddenly like them more...
Peace.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
"My cerebellum just fused..." - Calvin
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
_ /|
Jef Veatch \'o.O'
=(___)=
jveatc01@eng.eds.com U
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 1 May 95 12:17 PDT
From: chrisr@cts.com (Chris Richards)
Subject: Re: Amazing SynthAxe story
I propose
> that we come up with a note of appreciation to send to the members
> of Stone Temple Pilots -- can someone get me an address?
>
> Jeff
CR> Jeff,
You have great timing, I'm sitting here giving a demonstration of E-Mail to some
record producers, we just stumbled on the synthAxe story and all the little
black
books came out!
Stone Temple Pilots can be reached through their Manager:
Steve Stewart
6161 S. Monica Blvd.
Suite 303
Los Angeles, CA. 90038
Chris
Band tapes to: | Chris Richards
Fish Of Death Records | CineScout Location Services
P.O. Box 93206 | Motion Picture Locations
Los Angeles, CA. 90093 | (619)756.9429 (619)756.6951 (FAX)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 1 May 1995 19:40:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: Updated Harness order info
Paolo Valladolid was kind enough to provide me with the text of the
Harness advertisement in _GP_... it seems there is an unspecified
shipping and handling charge added to the $399 price of the unit
itself, but since Paolo included the phone number to Guitars West,
I rang them up and asked. The shipping and handling (UPS ground) is
$26 in North America; $36 elsewhere. So make those checks out for
$425 (or $435, if you live outside the U.S. or Canada).
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
========= End of Atavachron Digest ========= I
\ :::: ]I[ :::: /
Administrative requests to: : ::::::: ]] [[ ::::::: :
listserv@msuacad.morehead-st.edu ::: ]] [[ :::
''::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::''
Postings to: ::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
atavachron@msuacad.morehead-st.edu ::: =a=t=a=v=a=c=h=r=o=n= :::
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
For more info, send HELP as the first ,,::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::,,
line in e-mail to the listserv above. ::: ]] [[ :::
: :::::: ]] . [[ :::::: :
All opinions expressed herein are / :: ] ::: [ :: \
those of the individual contributors. I I
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tour Dates for Japan, Australia and more are available!
finger preston@msuacad.morehead-st.edu for the most current itinerary
Atavachron Digest - The Allan Holdsworth Discussion Digest
Number 150
Sunday, 7 May 1995
TODAY'S TOPICS:
==============
Re: Allan @ the helm...
Conversation Piece?
very silly Paul Williams question
Mystery mail from Planet Xerox
Re: very silly Paul Williams question
About that mystery mail...
Re: very silly Paul Williams question
Re: Atavachron Digest Number 148
Problem with ADATs?
Re: Atavachron Digest Number 148
Your very first exposure to AH?
Re: Your very first exposure to AH?
tickets for sale for King Crimson in London
Re: Atavachron Digest Number 148
Re: Your very first exposure to AH?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 1 May 1995 22:57:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Don Gunn
Subject: Re: Allan @ the helm...
Reed Ricker asked about Allan's producing/engineering talents in #149.
IMO, his efforts are somewhat inconsistent. I find this to be more true
when it comes to drum sounds than guitar, bass, & keys (I'm biased being
a drummer and engineer!). While this may seem trivial, a drum sound that
leaps from the speakers can make all the difference in how a recording is
perceived.
"Hard Hat Area", to me, just doesn't cut in the same way that "Secrets"
or "Metal Fatigue" do. It certainly isn't the fault of the drummer. Gary
Husband's playing has an undeniable power on all of Allan's releases
(Secrets excepted), but the mix just didn't do it for me on HHA. The
drums are too removed and in the background. I have wondered if it had
something to do with listening without a CircleSurround decoder; are there
phase anomolies occurring due to the processing?
On a more positive note, Allan's guitar sounds are consistently among the
best recorded, and the bass is always clean and punchy, yet full.
This is a touchy issue, because Allan obviously obsesses about the final
sound of his releases, and to comment on them and his technique as an
outsider is a bit odd.
Just my $.02!
Don Gunn
dg576@bard.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 May 1995 02:33:13 -0700
From: edju@chaph.usc.edu (Edward Ju)
Subject: Conversation Piece?
>From: Andre LaFosse
>
>I was was in a record store the other day and saw a copy of the album
>"Conversation Piece," with Holdsworth and three other musicians, whose
>names escape me. Can anyone describe this disc? What's it like, when
>was it recorded, who are the other personnel...
There are only 4 tracks on this disc:
22:34 Conversation Piece - Part I
17:14 Conversation Piece - Part II
19:32 Phil (A tribute to Phil Seamen)
9:59 Home
Tracks 1 & 2 were recorded & mixed on Nov 15, 1977 at BBC, Maida Vale,
London. Musicians involved: Holdsworth, Beck, Clyne & Stevens.
Tracks 3 & 4 were R & M at Riverside Recordings in London on Sep 1977.
These two were composed by John Stevens and Alllan did NOT play on them.
So what you are looking at are basically 40 minutes of something that
sounds like free-form studio jam - all 4 musicians were credited for composition
so you know it had to be a jam, plus there were no discernible forms or other
composition devices... I'd have to say that the music on Velvet Darkness
probably come closest to what the two Conversation Pieces sound like, but at
least the VD tracks were "half baked ideas" as opposed to the on-the-spot
improvisations recorded here. In short, I'd recommend it only for the die-hard
collector because the music itself is not on the par of any of Allan's solo
material. I can see how Allan would not have approved of this recording when
endorsing the discography...
Eddie
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Mr M P Hughes
Date: Tue, 2 May 95 10:39:00 BST
Subject: very silly Paul Williams question
Rumour has it that the Paul Williams who recently guested on Babylon 5 was
*the* Paul Williams. If so, which part did he play? (I'm guessing it's
the translator, but I'm not sure).
ObAllan: Given that AH is a trekker, what does he make of B5?
> So, Stone Temple Pilots BOUGHT Allan another one!
Weren't we going to do that, but thought AH would be too proud to accept it?
Michael
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 2 May 1995 13:56:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: Mystery mail from Planet Xerox
I received something in the mail today which has left me scratching
my pointy li'l noggin. The envelope was *not* postmarked/cancelled,
and there was no return address. The contents? Two photocopies of
what appear to be Japanese flyers -- one announcing Allan's dates
this week at the Pit Inn in Tokyo; the other, an announcement of the
upcoming album with Gordon Beck, which, if I'm reading this right,
seems to state 6/25/95 as the release date (in Japan, no doubt).
There was no further explanation or clue as to the source of the
two pages... I wonder if we perhaps have a Polygram operative in our
midst..? :)
I wonder if this came from the same person who sent a similar
package (a manila envelope, no return address -- but I think it was
postmarked from somewhere in New Jersey -- full of Japanese flyers,
bootleg ads, and various magazine articles and reviews in regards
to Allan) that arrived in my mailbox back around December. Hmm.
That package *did* have an accompanying letter, but I couldn't parse
the signature.
At any rate, I'll try to get these scanned in when I get home, and
add them to the Web page. Please, if anyone recognizes any of this
stuff -- especially the mystery signature -- please contact me. I'd
like to thank this person, but I don't know who to thank!
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston | preston@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Technical Support Specialist | ////\\\\////\\\\////\\\////\\\\
110 Ginger Hall, Morehead State University | (606) 783-5000
Morehead, Kentucky 40351 | (606) 783-5297
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Paul Morris"
Date: Tue, 2 May 1995 23:16:42 +0000
Subject: Re: very silly Paul Williams question
Oh well, here it goes - my second post:
Does it really matter who bought AH another one? The main thing as I
see it is that somebody did, and that it came from such an unlikely
source makes it even better in that it was a magnanimous gesture from
"brothers in music" who obviously have a greater qppreciation for
AH's playing than one would have imagined. On another note, does any
fellow Canadian Holdsworth fan know how or where to purchase his
recordings as many stores do not carry any of them? Thanks for the
help, til next time - keep on trekking.
Paul.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 3 May 1995 01:12:27 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: About that mystery mail...
Well...
I hope everyone can keep their enthusiasm in check regarding that
supposed Japanese release date for the Holdsworth/Beck/Willis/Covington
CD... I spoke with Claire this afternoon, and she said that flyer was
likely the result of Polygram's urging Akira Yada to provide them with
a release date. She went on to explain that Allan's troubles with the
Alesis ADATs have caused a major setback on the recording; in fact,
Alesis has refunded his money on the units, as they were unable to
adequately support the product to a point where Allan could continue
recording the project with them.
We also discussed the Harness. She mentioned that there was a "FAQ"
in the documentation, and that one of the FAQs, quite tongue-in-cheek,
was, "Can I use the Harness as a boat anchor?" :) This is owing to
its relatively substantial weight... the corresponding answer was (of
course!), "Yes; the Harness is well-suited for such an application,
and although the unit may still be functional, this will of course
void your warranty." ;)
She also said she can see no objection to our writing a note of
appreciation to Stone Temple Pilots' management regarding the recent
SynthAxe gift. Anyone interested?
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 3 May 1995 00:50:31 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Patrick M. McMillin"
Subject: Re: very silly Paul Williams question
I wanted to take a defensive tone regarding this topic. I
certainly don't feel that Mr. William's question was silly.
It is quite valid. Simply saying that the important thing
is that Allan has a new one fails to address the reasons why
it would have been inappropriate for the Atava to give him
a new one. I too am delighted to see this type of fellowship
and recognition, and understand jeff's suggestions on not
trying to buy Allan a system. But there is nothing silly
about the question, much less very silly.
|) Patrick M. McMillin
/ The University of Texas at Austin
/| patrick-mc@mail.utexas.edu
/ |__
( (|_ ) Save the bandwidth...
\_|_/ Cut text!!!
J
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 3 May 1995 06:35:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Mason
Subject: Re: Atavachron Digest Number 148
Hi,
This is just *wonderful!!!*.... elitists who have a sense of humour and,
on top of all that, have apparently read Thoedore Sturgeon!!
That alone has absolutely made my day. Thanks, folks!!
And, bye the bye, Trilok Gurtu does always squat on the floor like
that.... pretty bizarre but, hey, if it ain't broke don't fix it!
Regards,
Paul
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 3 May 95 08:43:03 PDT
From: "Chris Manuel"
Subject: Problem with ADATs?
To: ATAVACHR--INTERNET atavachron@msuacad
Jeff mentioned that AH has dumped his ADATs and received a refund from Alesis.
As an ADAT user I would really like to know what problems Allan experienced.
I'm using one ADAT synched to my Mac running Cubase Audio and have had no
problems. I dream of adding a second ADAT so I can make tape backups and have
another 8 tracks. I recall an earlier post mentioning that AH was having
problems synching two (or more?) ADATs. Anyway, any chance of getting more
information?
Chris Manuel
BC Systems Corporation
V: 604.389.3503 F:360.7285
CPMANUEL@BCSC02.GOV.BC.CA
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 5 May 1995 03:34:27 -0400
From: HCarlH@aol.com
Subject: Re: Atavachron Digest Number 148
I notice that many of the message subjects read something like "Re:
Atavachron Digest Number 148". Is there a separate mailing list for the
Digest? I seem to be only receiving various comments from people about miscel
laneous topics.
BTW, does Claire know if Allan is going to be doing anything in the future
with Southern California jazz guitarist "extraordinaire" Robert Conti who
plays at the Irvine Marriott? I know that Allan is impressed with his
playing and wanted to do something a couple of years ago but nothing
surfaced.
Carl Hardwick
(HCarlH@aol.com)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 6 May 1995 10:01:23 +0500
From: fstopron@inforamp.net (Ron Belli)
Subject: Your very first exposure to AH?
Feeling a bit "nostalgic" lately, I tried recalling the very first time I
heard Allan play and the impression it left me: I was nineteen years old,
in college, with just enough money left over one week to buy a new Jean-Luc
Ponty album (Enigmatic Ocean-1977). Well, when I first heard this "unknown"
guitarist wailing away on tracks like "Nostalgic Lady" I thought to myself,
"Wow, I wonder what his fingers are doing to sound like that!!!" Needless
to say, I've followed Allan's career ever since.
Anyone else in our group interested in sharing his/her first experience
listening to AH?
P.S. For a guy who is dangerously close to approaching 40, I'm proud to
say that I haven't (as yet) succumbed to Elevator/Easy-Listening music.
Regards,
Ron Belli
Toronto, Ontario
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Paul Morris"
Date: Sat, 6 May 1995 15:32:59 +0000
Subject: Re: Your very first exposure to AH?
> Date: Sat, 6 May 1995 10:38:16 -0400
> Reply-to:
> From: fstopron@inforamp.net (Ron Belli)
> To: Multiple recipients of list
> Subject: Your very first exposure to AH?
> Feeling a bit "nostalgic" lately, I tried recalling the very first time I
> heard Allan play and the impression it left me: I was nineteen years old,
> in college, with just enough money left over one week to buy a new Jean-Luc
> Ponty album (Enigmatic Ocean-1977). Well, when I first heard this "unknown"
> guitarist wailing away on tracks like "Nostalgic Lady" I thought to myself,
> "Wow, I wonder what his fingers are doing to sound like that!!!" Needless
> to say, I've followed Allan's career ever since.
> Anyone else in our group interested in sharing his/her first experience
> listening to AH?
>
> P.S. For a guy who is dangerously close to approaching 40, I'm proud to
> say that I haven't (as yet) succumbed to Elevator/Easy-Listening music.
>
> Regards,
> Ron Belli
> Toronto, Ontario
>
> I too would like to day that the first time I heard AH was in the
70's when a good friend of mine turned me on to AH's playing with
Bill BRuford et al. Being a newbie at the time to jazz and related
musical forms I was amazed at the vitality of his playing, and
promptly became a convert to his fanbase. I still have fondness for
listening to UK and all the rest of that 70's stuff [including RTF &
Billy Cobham too] . One thing that I would love to hear is AH
getting together with Al DiMeola to jam - I think that they probably
already greatly respect each other's ability and if they were
together with others like Stanley Clarke or Jeff Berlin and Billy
Cobham, the result would probably be a feast for music lovers!
Anyway I just wanted to say that in my opinion, as I,m sure the rest
of you agree, AH is in a stellar class of artists and has served to
broaden many persons' musical appreciation.
Peace, and take care,-
Paul.Morris
Hamilton
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 6 May 1995 22:28:57 +0100
From: Jason Grossman
Subject: tickets for sale for King Crimson in London
I have one spare ticket for King Crimson's concert in the Albert Hall on
May the 17th, and one for May the 18th. You can have one or both for
whatever I paid for them - I don't remember exactly, but I think they're
about 15 pounds each.
If you're interested, please phone me on Cambridge (01223, assuming you're
in the UK) 562786, but don't bother phoning until the evening of Friday the
12th, because I've just moved and my phone's not connected yet! Don't reply
by email or by posting here: I won't be using my computer for a while.
Jason Grossman
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 07 May 1995 11:13:54 -0500 (CDT)
From: ST40V@Jetson.UH.EDU
Subject: Re: Atavachron Digest Number 148
How do you order "Gongzilla" ?
st5fh@jetson.uh.edu
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 07 May 1995 11:22:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: X90LESAGE@wmich.edu
Subject: Re: Your very first exposure to AH?
Funny that I came in today to find someone recounting their first AH
listening experience. I was just talking about it to a friend last night and
thought about bringing the topic up on atavachron.
The first time I heard AH I was 19 yrs old and had been getting into
Zappa, King Crimson, various "fusion" guitarists (e.g., Scofield, DiMeola), and
various jazz bands (e.g., Basie, Ellington). It was a period of rapid
musical growth for me; playing in a jazz band, and living with
music majors in college. One summer, my neighbor and I were playing guitar
together when he had me check out Metal Fatigue. After hearing the first
phrase in the opening of the title track, with that delightfully bizzare
distorted harmonizor thing, I said to him, "I'm going to buy this album. I
already know I HAVE to buy this album!" No shit Samantha, I was hooked
after hearing just a few notes. I hastily bought Metal Fatigue, then IOU.
These two albums kept me satisfied for quite a while. I simply couldn't
get burned out on them. I think it was the pure novelty of the experience
that floored me. Not only was it new for me (in that I had never heard
this guitar player before), but I realized that it was something
that had never been done before, truely unique composition and improvisation.
I was in a sonic world I had never heard before.
I experienced these feelings again, but with much greater intensity, the
first time I saw AH. I couldn't believe what I was witnessing. Seeing
him in some way made the music real, in that the fact was empirically
verified that a human being could actually play such bewildering music.
It was the Sand tour and Allan used the synthaxe for most of the concert.
Seeing Allan use this futuristic instrument that I had never seen before
made me feel like I had been catapulted forward in time to the year 2110 :)
My best friend (a drummer) and I were laughing to tears rejoicing in our
experience of another world, we weren't on earth anymore. Totally engrossed
in the beauty of what was being created before our very eyes, we forgot
the rest of our lives.
Regards,
Mark LeSage |
Department of Psychology | "...when [introspectionists] come to
Western Michigan University | analyze consciousness, naturally they find in
Kalamazoo, MI 49008 | it just what they put into it."
Tel: 616-387-4503 |
email: x90lesage@wmich.edu | J.B. Watson (1924, p. 4)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I ========= End of Atavachron Digest =========
\ :::: ]I[ :::: /
: ::::::: ]] [[ ::::::: : Administrative requests to:
::: ]] [[ ::: listserv@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
''::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::''
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ ::: Postings to:
::: =a=t=a=v=a=c=h=r=o=n= ::: atavachron@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
,,::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::,, For more info, send HELP as first
::: ]] [[ ::: line in e-mail to the listserv above.
: :::::: ]] . [[ :::::: :
/ :: ] ::: [ :: \ All opinions expressed herein are
I I those of the individual contributors.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tour Dates for Japan, Australia and more are available!
finger preston@msuacad.morehead-st.edu for the most current itinerary
Atavachron Digest - The Allan Holdsworth Discussion Digest
Number 151
Monday, 8 May 1995
TODAY'S TOPICS:
==============
misc
Melbourne, Australia dates...
First exposure to Holdsworth
Re: Your very first exposure to AH?
Re: very silly Paul Williams question
Re: very silly Paul Williams question
AH releases in Canada
Re: first AH experience
RE: Atavachron Digest Number 150
Gongzilla from CD Connection... NOT! (was: misc)
Re: very silly Paul Williams question
Re: very silly Paul Williams question
Gongzilla ordering
Re: very silly Paul Williams question
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 7 May 1995 17:44:26 -0500
From: gastarit@comm.net
Subject: misc
Hi,
I think my first exposure to AH was the first Tempest album...then Velvet
Darkness (a few cuts I liked, anyway).
Also, I too have been trying to get Gongzilla. I've ordered it twice from
cdconnection and after a week and a half of following up on the status, it
always comes back as out of stock. In fact everything I've ordered from them
is always Out-of-Stock ! Anyone else have any alternatives ?
Glenn
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Duncan Chung Wing Mok
Subject: Melbourne, Australia dates...
Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 09:26:05 +1000 (EST)
Hi Jeff,
You asked me to confirm the venue for Allan's Melbourne dates...
As I posted previously, Allan _is_ playing The Continental, on May 16 and 17,
with a clinic on May 17 during the day. Unfortunately, I can't afford the time
to go (sickening really, since he's finally found a classy venue to play...)
due to my final year university commitments.
So, just to repeat, Allan is playing The Continental, _not_ The Grainstore.
Cheers,
Dunk
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Duncan CW Mok Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology University
B.Eng (Computer Systems Engineering) B.App.Sci (Computer Science)
_-_|\ 8 Maitland Avenue Telephone: (+613) 9817 1395
/ \ East Kew VIC 3102 Facsimile: (+613) 9817 4659
\_.-._/ AUSTRALIA email: s914398@yallara.cs.rmit.edu.au
v
Data-Tech Systems Telephone: (+613) 9894 1177
4 Solwood Lane Facsimile: (+613) 9894 3011
Blackburn VIC 3130
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Richard Huddleston
Date: Sun, 7 May 1995 21:09:09 -0400
Subject: First exposure to Holdsworth
Soft Machine, "Bundles"--and I have absolutely no idea how old it is.
I moved it to reel tape at least 15 years ago, however, and it was an
old album even then. Early 70s sounds right.
The things was were/are notable about Allan's work on that album:
(1) Even then, he rolled off the high end
(2) Even then, his lines were fluid and harmonically complex
...in particular, it was easy (compared to his later work, that is ;) to
pick up where he was coming from harmonically. The solos were extended, and
mostly built on a single tonic. His tone was clear, and his lines were
rhythmically much simplier than his later work (mostly long, straight runs
of 32nd notes) but which meandered through every possible harmonic nook and
cranny.
Great stuff.
Richard
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 7 May 1995 23:14:23 -0700
From: edju@chaph.usc.edu (Edward Ju)
Subject: Re: Your very first exposure to AH?
19 must be the magical age... I discovered Allan when I was 19 too.
I was heavily into Joe Satriani at the time, who just released his Flying
in a Blue Dream album. On an issue of Guitar World, several visible guitarists
were asked what top 5 player/albums are, and along with Satriani, a lot of
shredders also sang praises of "Metal Fatigue." Intrigued, I went out looking
for it but could not find it in a lot of stores. At the time Allan's
recordings were distributed by Enigma Records. Finally I was able to locate a
copy on tape at Tower Records.
When I listened to the tape for the first time, I was disappointed.
You have to understand that I was a primitive metal-head back then, and wasn't
able to comprehend the deeper and better music of Allan. So the tape were
left unheard for a few months until summer break, when I returned home without
my CD collection. Bored without new music, I started digging out the tapes that
I didn't pay much attention to, and among them Metal Fatigue was the only one
that grew on me. By the time summer ended and I came back to school, I was
hungry for more! Eventually I was able to track down all of Allan's solo CDs
except for Road Games, which wasn't released on CD.
I am not too excited about the new direction Allan's taken ever since
Wardencliffe Tower. Personally my favorite CD is Atavachron. It's got that
80s synth sound which I guess makes me nostalgic in a big way. Hopefully he
will soon make another album like that!
Eddie
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Mr M P Hughes
Date: Mon, 8 May 95 09:14:16 BST
Subject: Re: very silly Paul Williams question
Woah, I think we have some crossed wires here...
> I certainly don't feel that Mr. William's question was silly.
> It is quite valid. Simply saying that the important thing
> is that Allan has a new one fails to address the reasons why
> it would have been inappropriate for the Atava to give him
> a new one.
The EMail in question was from Mr Hughes, ie me. The silly part was, what
part was Paul Williams playing in a recent (series 2) episode of Babylon
5. Paul williams is the guy who sang on Metal Fatigue and with Tempest.
I think he played a short alien (he is quite short, I think) who spoke
on behalf of a taller companion.
> Oh well, here it goes - my second post:
> Does it really matter who bought AH another one?
Absolutely not. Besides, I don't think we could have raised sufficient cash
to get him one. (A z-tar, maybe). What got me is that this group started off
ringing with enthusiasm for buying a Synthaxxe, then some beer, and finally
the subject faded out without anyone having done anything.
(BTW, if the ObAllan is obscure, it meant "Obligatory Allan comment, so
that the post wasn't totally Holdsworth free!)
Michael
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 08:17:37 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: Re: very silly Paul Williams question
> From: Mr M P Hughes
> Subject: Re: very silly Paul Williams question
> > Oh well, here it goes - my second post:
> > Does it really matter who bought AH another one?
> Absolutely not. Besides, I don't think we could have raised sufficient cash
> to get him one. (A z-tar, maybe). What got me is that this group started off
> ringing with enthusiasm for buying a Synthaxxe, then some beer, and finally
> the subject faded out without anyone having done anything.
Hey, I'm up for taking up whatever donations anyone wants to send
towards a possible birthday gift, etc., but my objections to our
trying to get up enough cash for a SynthAxe were twofold -- firstly,
SynthAxes are NOT inexpensive, nor easily located; secondly, although
I'm sure Allan would have been appreciative, I didn't know if it were
entirely appropriate for us to undertake such a task. At any rate, I
hope no one is "waiting for my cue," as it were... if you folks have
an idea, I would hope someone would step forward and organize it
towards the desired ends. As long as it has something to do with
Allan, this forum is just waiting to be used! :) As many things as
I have going on in my life at the moment, I simply have to bow out of
any nominations for Chairman of the Fund-Raising Committee -- but that
needn't stop anyone else.
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 07:50:52 -0600
From: aa6tt@frontier.net (William H. Hein)
Subject: AH releases in Canada
Restless Records recently changed distributors in Canada from Cargo to
Outside Music. This should significantly improve the Canadian stock
situation on all Restless titles, including, of course, the Holdsworth
releases. Anyone in Canada having trouble finding Holdsworth CDs should
request that their local record shop order same from Outside Music in
Toronto, telephone (416) 364-2778.
Restless also operates a mail order service, with all Holdsworth titles on
Restless available. For a catalog and ordering information, drop a note to
Restless Mailorder, 1616 Vista Del Mar Avenue, Hollywood, California
90028-6420, USA.
William Hein
co-owner
Restless Records
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
William H. Hein, PO Bx 579, Ignacio, Colorado 81137-0579 USA
fone 970/883-2415 fax 970/883-2408 Internet aa6tt@frontier.net
AA6TT is in Tiffany, Colorado, grid square DM67fb
*** To subscribe to the 160m DX Internet mailing list, email the message
"subscribe" to topband-request@lists.frontier.net ***
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 10:31:39 -0400 (EDT)
From: Ashley Collins
Subject: Re: first AH experience
I'm a little embarrassed, but my first time hearing AH was the result of
nothing more than a whim. My parents were getting me a CD player for my
17th birthday and I decided to check out some music stores and prepare for
this wonderful gift of technology. At the time I was a would-be guitarist
and would-be disciple of Vai, Satriani, Van Halen, et al. (i.e. I had
great dreams of being a huge shredder like these guys but not enough
discipline to practice; since then I've been concentrating more on
melody/harmony instead of 500 mph solos in both my playing and listening).
Anyway, I was checking out the used bin in a locally owned place and found
a copy of Metal Fatigue. I'd read in my countless guitar magazines that
this was an incredible guitar album, so, never having heard a note of it, I
decided, "What the hey?" and bought it. It was aobut a week and a half
before I was actually able to listen to it, but when I did, I was simply
blown away! His technical abilities knocked the little speed demon in me
off his feet, and his sophistication and taste helped get me into jazz and
out of "other" styles of music. I won't go into much detail on this as I
know there are a number of people on this list who are touched by AH's
music mostly on a pyrotechnical level. Looking back over this post, I'm
detecting a snobbish air that I did not intend to present. I'll just say
that this is no longer where I derive my inspiration from, but I realize
that not everyone shares my view on music and I respect that (and I'm good
enough, I'm smart enough, and doggone it, people like me).
At any rate, I.O.U., Atavachron, and the rest of AH's albums were
not far behind, and I've been a convert ever since.
Ashley Collins
acollins@CapAccess.org
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Baron, Mike"
Subject: RE: Atavachron Digest Number 150
Date: Mon, 08 May 95 13:40:00 PDT
A friend of mine forwarded this to me:
>From the June issue of Music News Network, the International Monthly
>Progressive Rock Newsletter:
"We've just received word that U.K. is definitely on. Eddie Jobson and
John Wetton have been working to define what U.K. should be in the 90's.
They are developing new sounds and making new music because they can, not
because they have to. The bulk of the new music will be recorded at
Eddie's studio this summer and fall.
Both Bill Bruford [!] and Allan Holdsworth [!!] will be playing on the new
album as their busy schedules permit. John Wetton's management advised
that Bruford has provided "some very cool ideas that John and Eddie intend
to incorporate into the 'sound' of the new U.K." The record should be
released in early 1996 and a tour may follow."
Mike Baron
mike.baron@isl.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 May 95 10:40:34 -0500
From: uchima@fncrd8.fnal.gov (Mike Uchima)
Subject: Gongzilla from CD Connection... NOT! (was: misc)
gastarit@comm.net wrote:
> ...
> Also, I too have been trying to get Gongzilla. I've ordered it twice from
> cdconnection and after a week and a half of following up on the status, it
> always comes back as out of stock. In fact everything I've ordered from them
> is always Out-of-Stock ! Anyone else have any alternatives ?
>
> Glenn
I got the "out of stock" thing from CD Connection too. I finally just ordered
it direct from LOLO (sent $15.00 to LOLO RECORDS P.O. Box 122 Riverton, N.J.
08077). The CD arrived in the mail less than a week later.
Odd to hear that someone's been having so much trouble with CDC -- you must
order some *really* obscure stuff. Other than the Gongzilla CD, they've been
able to ship just about everything I've ordered from them in the past...
-- Mike Uchima
-- uchima@fnal.fnal.gov
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 May 1995 12:09:38 -0400 (EDT)
From: X90LESAGE@wmich.edu
Subject: Re: very silly Paul Williams question
Mr Hughes,
I would like to explain why the enthusiasm waned for purchasing a synthax.
Recall that Jeff Preston explained to all of us that Allan probably would
feel comfortable receiving such a gift. We just didn't want to create
an awkward social situation for Allan. I thought Jeff made quite clear
the reasons for not pursuing it. The waning in overt enthusiasm in no
way indicates a loss of empathy and desire to help on our part. Maybe
Jeff could explain again why grandiose gratuities should be avoided, I forgot
most of his eloquent points.
Regards,
Mark LeSage |
Department of Psychology | "...when [introspectionists] come to
Western Michigan University | analyze consciousness, naturally they find in
Kalamazoo, MI 49008 | it just what they put into it."
Tel: 616-387-4503 |
email: x90lesage@wmich.edu | J.B. Watson (1924, p. 4)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 May 1995 12:26:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: X90LESAGE@wmich.edu
Subject: Re: very silly Paul Williams question
I just realized an important typo! What I meant to write in my last post
was that Allan might feel UNcomfortatble about receiving as grandiose of
a gratuity as a synthaxe. Sorry for the confusion :{
Mark LeSage |
Department of Psychology | "...when [introspectionists] come to
Western Michigan University | analyze consciousness, naturally they find in
Kalamazoo, MI 49008 | it just what they put into it."
Tel: 616-387-4503 |
email: x90lesage@wmich.edu | J.B. Watson (1924, p. 4)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 May 1995 12:29:42 -0400 (EDT)
From: X90LESAGE@wmich.edu
Subject: Gongzilla ordering
I wanted to confirm the address for LOLO Records.
P.O. Box 122
Riverton, NJ 08077
Is this correct? To order, I just send a letter describing the CD I
want and enclose $15.00?
Regards,
Mark LeSage |
Department of Psychology | "...when [introspectionists] come to
Western Michigan University | analyze consciousness, naturally they find in
Kalamazoo, MI 49008 | it just what they put into it."
Tel: 616-387-4503 |
email: x90lesage@wmich.edu | J.B. Watson (1924, p. 4)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 12:37:56 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: Re: very silly Paul Williams question
> From: X90LESAGE@wmich.edu
> Subject: Re: very silly Paul Williams question
> I would like to explain why the enthusiasm waned for purchasing a synthax.
> Recall that Jeff Preston explained to all of us that Allan probably would
> feel comfortable receiving such a gift. We just didn't want to create
> an awkward social situation for Allan.
[...]
> Maybe
> Jeff could explain again why grandiose gratuities should be avoided, I forgot
> most of his eloquent points.
I don't really see the need, as it is much ado about nothing; you've
covered it pretty much in your posting above. :) Again, I want to
STRESS that I would be 100% cooperative and supportive of any kind of
gift/collection efforts for Allan and family, but I simply have no time
to *organize* any such efforts at this time. Anyone who wants to start
up something along these lines, hey, this is the place to start making
inquiries (since there are a LOT of Holdsworth fans here, no?).
As for the SynthAxe, I don't really feel like Stone Temple Pilots'
"beat us to the punch" on that -- I have serious doubts that we could
have raised the cash AND located a controller by now -- even if we had
started in November when the unit was ripped off from the Catalina.
Besides, I'm sure Allan feels a lot less self-conscious about accepting
an expensive gift like that from a bunch of music-industry millionaires
than he would have felt accepting it from our rag-tag group! :)
Please, can we let this die now? ;)
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
========= End of Atavachron Digest ========= I
\ :::: ]I[ :::: /
Administrative requests to: : ::::::: ]] [[ ::::::: :
listserv@msuacad.morehead-st.edu ::: ]] [[ :::
''::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::''
Postings to: ::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
atavachron@msuacad.morehead-st.edu ::: =a=t=a=v=a=c=h=r=o=n= :::
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
For more info, send HELP as the first ,,::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::,,
line in e-mail to the listserv above. ::: ]] [[ :::
: :::::: ]] . [[ :::::: :
All opinions expressed herein are / :: ] ::: [ :: \
those of the individual contributors. I I
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tour Dates for Japan, Australia and more are available!
finger preston@msuacad.morehead-st.edu for the most current itinerary
Atavachron Digest - The Allan Holdsworth Discussion Digest
Number 152
Tuesday, 9 May 1995
TODAY'S TOPICS:
==============
Gongzilla
Re: Atavachron Digest Number 151
The grunge rock dinosaur recovery unit (?!)
Re: The grunge rock dinosaur recovery unit (?!)
(none)
Re: The grunge rock dinosaur recovery unit (?!)
Re: The grunge rock dinosaur recovery unit (?!)
Meeting the great man himself!
Re: Meeting the great man himself!
Re: Meeting the great man himself!
Re: down under
Comment on Roland Guitar Simulator
Re: Comment on Roland Guitar Simulator
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Malcolm Humes
Subject: Gongzilla
Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 11:09:40 -0700 (PDT)
>I wanted to confirm the address for LOLO Records.
> P.O. Box 122 Riverton,
> NJ 08077
> Is this correct?
Yes. Also, other points of contact are:
bonlo@delphi.com
fax - 609-829-8421
phone - 609-829-1536
or 514-525-8204 (Montreal)
I can't offhand confirm the pricing, but I think the $15 cost is
correct.
My impression is it's Bon's label, run by his friends/family.
There's a couple of other release on the label or pending soon,
including Project Lo: Dabblings in Darkness, featuring PErcy Jones
as one of teh guest bassists, and Pierre Moerlen. Release date on
this one is noted as May 15th.
I got Gongzilla and also Bon's "Full Circle/Coming Home" cds,
I'm hoping to get a real review of these once I have time to
sit down and really digest it, but on initial impression I like
both releases. The Gongzilla surprised me, I didn't really expect
it to be this good, or to be as reminiscent of Expresso/Expresso II
era Gong.
- Malcolm
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 08 May 1995 14:13:02 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Karmachanic, with overall charms"
Subject: Re: Atavachron Digest Number 151
>The EMail in question was from Mr Hughes, ie me. The silly part was, what
>part was Paul Williams playing in a recent (series 2) episode of Babylon
>5. Paul williams is the guy who sang on Metal Fatigue and with Tempest.
>I think he played a short alien (he is quite short, I think) who spoke
>on behalf of a taller companion.
I saw Paul Williams with the original IOU linup, as I remember he's actually
a pretty big guy, for what it's worth. Too bad they had a falling out, or
whatever happened, I really liked his singing...
Tom O'Toole - ecf_stbo@jhuvms.hcf.jhu.edu - JHUVMS system programmer
Homewood Computing Facilities, Johns Hopkins University, Balto. Md. 21218
>Here comes a jet ski.
>weuh weeuhh weeuhh weeuhh WEEUHH WEEUHH WEEUHH WEEUHH weeuhh weeuhh weeuhh weuh
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 12:33:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andre LaFosse
Subject: The grunge rock dinosaur recovery unit (?!)
Jeff sez:
> Please, can we let this die now? ;)
> Jeff
Certainly not!
But what I want to know is, where the hell did STP *find* a SynthAxe?
It's not the sort of thing you can turn up by perusing a few pawn shops in
one afternoon's shopping spree (or *is* it?!?!) I have a hard time
envisioning Scott Weiland and co. going to great lengths of time and
expense searching for one of the most obscure musical dinosaurs of the
past decade on behalf of a fusion icon with little obvious connection to
them either personally or artistically -- yet it that that's exactly what
they did. (I remember Holdsworth saying there were maybe a thousand
SynthAxes in existance.) I'd be very intrigued to hear the details of this
particular act of altruism, and exactly how the band tracked down the unit
in question.
What I *really* want to see, though, is a photo of the eternally
distressed-looking Holdsworth posing with the STP boys themselves, Allan's
enigmatic gaze rubbing elbows with Weiland's self-styled scowl of ennui.
(I can see the _Guitar World_ headline now: "Holdsworth passes musical
torch to unlikely candidate...") That would be the GIF of the year...
So what's next -- Pearl Jam buys Adrian Belew a Synclavier?
--Andre LaFosse
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: pvallado@waynesworld.UCSD.EDU (Paolo Valladolid)
Subject: Re: The grunge rock dinosaur recovery unit (?!)
Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 13:39:35 -0700 (PDT)
[Moderator's note (for future reference): Didja know that if you start
a line with the word "From" that the listserv software decides that
*that* is the beginning of a new mail header? Yep -- it chops up any
post that has "From" as the start of a line. So, I've added some
colorful characters to the beginning of Paolo's first non-quoted
sentence below; apologies for the inconvenience! --JP]
> Certainly not!
>
> But what I want to know is, where the hell did STP *find* a SynthAxe?
> It's not the sort of thing you can turn up by perusing a few pawn shops in
> one afternoon's shopping spree (or *is* it?!?!) I have a hard time
> envisioning Scott Weiland and co. going to great lengths of time and
> expense searching for one of the most obscure musical dinosaurs of the
> past decade on behalf of a fusion icon with little obvious connection to
> them either personally or artistically -- yet it that that's exactly what
> they did. (I remember Holdsworth saying there were maybe a thousand
> SynthAxes in existance.) I'd be very intrigued to hear the details of this
> particular act of altruism, and exactly how the band tracked down the unit
> in question.
--->From what I recall, STP's guitar player is a fan of 70s fusion.
> So what's next -- Pearl Jam buys Adrian Belew a Synclavier?
Belew never had a Synclavier stolen. Maybe they can finance the
construction of new baritone Delap guitars to replace the
ones Allan had to give up as collateral for the stolen synthaxe.
--
Paolo Valladolid
-----------------------------------------------------------------
|Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\
|for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \
----------------------------------------------------------------- |
\ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ |
\ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \|
-----------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: pvallado@waynesworld.UCSD.EDU (Paolo Valladolid)
Subject: Re: The grunge rock dinosaur recovery unit (?!)
Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 15:35:50 -0700 (PDT)
Hmm....
I guess my reply did not make it so i'll try again. I just
wanted to say that I read somewhere that the guitarist for STP
is a big fusion fan; hence the connection.
[Moderator's note: It made it... just not in one piece. That leading
"From" in your first sentence threw it a curve. :-/ --JP]
--
Paolo Valladolid
-----------------------------------------------------------------
|Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\
|for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \
----------------------------------------------------------------- |
\ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ |
\ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \|
-----------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 9 May 1995 17:35:24 +1000
From: Michael Ibrahim
Subject: Meeting the great man himself!
Just half an hour ago I met the great man himself. I guess I might as well tell
you guys, because no-one here at the plasma physics department seems to care. I
got his autograph, and had a bit of a chat to him. One of the things he
mentioned was that he doesn't think that he's going to be using the new bit of
gear from Roland. He said that it doesn't quite work the way he wants it to. He
figures that if you want the guitar to sound like a strat, there's no better
way than to go out and by yourself a strat!
I'm going to catch the gig tonight (and as a matter of fact every night). I
made the mistake of only seeing Allan once when he toured here last year. I'm
not making that mistake again.
Seeing that you're all getting really nostalgic, I figure I might as well join
in. I was at a friend's place a few years ago. He was given a tape by someone,
and he hadn't gotten around to listening to that tape. So he decided to give it
a play. What we hear made our brains melt. We later found out that it was
infact Holdsworth. I have been looking for that album ever since. I bought all
his solo stuff in search of this album, and in the process, I became a huge
fan. Anyway, this album turned out to be the Chad Wackermann ablum, Forty
Reasons.
Best be off. I have the gig to go to after all....
I'm also draging along about 20 of my friends to the gig. Half of them have
never even heard of Allan. A hand-full of them are into groups like
boys-to-men, so that should be a VERY Interesting experience!!!
Later.
Miko.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 09 May 1995 10:06:47 -0400 (EDT)
From: X90LESAGE@wmich.edu
Subject: Re: Meeting the great man himself!
Mr. Ibrahim,
Please comment on your friends' response to Allan. I think it would be
very interesting to see what verbal responses are evoked by Allan's
music falling on novice ears. It would also be interesting to look at
relations between a person's listening history and their verbal/emotional
responses (likes/dislikes) to Allan's music (esp. the people that are into
Boys-to-Men :)
Thanks,
Mark LeSage |
Department of Psychology | "...when [introspectionists] come to
Western Michigan University | analyze consciousness, naturally they find in
Kalamazoo, MI 49008 | it just what they put into it."
Tel: 616-387-4503 |
email: x90lesage@wmich.edu | J.B. Watson (1924, p. 4)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 9 May 1995 09:31:42 -0500 (CDT)
From: 3rdStone <3rdstone@io.com>
Subject: Re: Meeting the great man himself!
On Tue, 9 May 1995, 07:38:15, Michael Ibrahim wrote:
> Just half an hour ago I met the great man himself.
Where at seven in the morning do you come upon Holdsworth? In bed?
[Moderator's note: Hmmm... *Australia*, maybe? That IS where Allan
and Co. is touring at the moment; doesn't anyone read the list of
tour dates I so lovingly and painstakingly prepare? ;) --JP]
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 09 May 1995 20:20:46 +0200
From: rene@via.nl (Rene Janssen)
Subject: Re: down under
>
>On Tue, 9 May 1995, 07:38:15, Michael Ibrahim wrote:
>
>> Just half an hour ago I met the great man himself.
>
>Where at seven in the morning do you come upon Holdsworth? In bed?
>
> [Moderator's note: Hmmm... *Australia*, maybe? That IS where Allan
> and Co. is touring at the moment; doesn't anyone read the list of
> tour dates I so lovingly and painstakingly prepare? ;) --JP]
>
I guess his Timezone variable or his systemclock is not set correct or
the listserv changed the time, but it could also have been a moment of
time-unawareness after his meeting down under ( right under my feet ) ;)
Or ( very unlikely ) the note suffered from time-dilation caused by an
unexpected energy momentum (AH) which appeared to the stationary observer (JP)
as timestamped seven in the morning but happened much later ? (or earlier ?)
Einstein : dt = dt' / sqrt ( 1 - v2 / c2 ) = y-1 . dt'
Rene.
\/
Rene Janssen. /\
e-mail : rene@via.nl_______||__________________
WWW : http://www.via.nl/users/rene/rene.html
_______
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 9 May 95 08:57:15 PDT
From: "Chris Manuel"
Subject: Comment on Roland Guitar Simulator
To: ATAVACHR--INTERNET atavachron@msuacad
Interesting to hear that AH has chosen not to employ the new Roland Guitar
Simulator. My first reaction when I heard about it was similar. I really like
playing different guitars for different sounds. The guitar is such a tactile
instrument that I would miss the feeling of wrestling with different scales
and string gauges.
On the other hand it will probably result in some interesting, unexpected
sounds when it falls into the hands of the likes of Adrian Belem. I suppose
there is a place for it. (But the price, whew!)
Chris Manuel
BC Systems Corporation, Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
cpmanuel@bcsc02.gov.bc.ca
http://eps.gov.bc.ca:3893/~cpmanuel/Chris/INDEX.HTML
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: pvallado@waynesworld.UCSD.EDU (Paolo Valladolid)
Subject: Re: Comment on Roland Guitar Simulator
Date: Tue, 9 May 1995 12:58:10 -0700 (PDT)
> To: ATAVACHR--INTERNET atavachron@msuacad
>
> Interesting to hear that AH has chosen not to employ the new Roland Guitar
> Simulator. My first reaction when I heard about it was similar. I really like
> playing different guitars for different sounds. The guitar is such a tactile
> instrument that I would miss the feeling of wrestling with different scales
> and string gauges.
The Roland VG8 is not a synthesizer, though. It is really an effects
processor that processes each guitar string individually. I tried
it briefly last week and what others have said about it was true;
all the sounds on the VG8 respond to even the most subtle movements
of your fingers and pick on the strings. The simulated guitar/amp/mic
models were nice but I was more interested in the "synth" sounds.
The violin/cello and flute sounds were very nice. Perhaps the main
issue with Allan might be that the VG8 responds *too much* like
a guitar; he's really looking for a surrogate horn. For one thing,
I don't think it has a breath controller.
> On the other hand it will probably result in some interesting, unexpected
> sounds when it falls into the hands of the likes of Adrian Belem. I suppose
> there is a place for it. (But the price, whew!)
>
> Chris Manuel
> BC Systems Corporation, Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
> cpmanuel@bcsc02.gov.bc.ca
> http://eps.gov.bc.ca:3893/~cpmanuel/Chris/INDEX.HTML
>
--
Paolo Valladolid
-----------------------------------------------------------------
|Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\
|for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \
----------------------------------------------------------------- |
\ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ |
\ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \|
-----------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I ========= End of Atavachron Digest =========
\ :::: ]I[ :::: /
: ::::::: ]] [[ ::::::: : Administrative requests to:
::: ]] [[ ::: listserv@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
''::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::''
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ ::: Postings to:
::: =a=t=a=v=a=c=h=r=o=n= ::: atavachron@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
,,::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::,, For more info, send HELP as first
::: ]] [[ ::: line in e-mail to the listserv above.
: :::::: ]] . [[ :::::: :
/ :: ] ::: [ :: \ All opinions expressed herein are
I I those of the individual contributors.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tour Dates for Japan, Australia and more are available!
finger preston@msuacad.morehead-st.edu for the most current itinerary
Atavachron Digest - The Allan Holdsworth Discussion Digest
Number 153
Thursday, 11 May 1995
TODAY'S TOPICS:
==============
(none)
Re: Comment on Roland Guitar Simulator
RE: Gonzilla
My first time with Allan
Re: Gonzilla
Re: My first time with Allan
Re: Bonlo?
Re: Atavachron Digest Number 150
Revised Homepage
Ogerman/Brecker "Cityscapes" CD release
RE: Cityscape
The Gig, Sysney, Tuesday night.
Re: The Gig, Sysney, Tuesday night. / Trial Balloon
Re: The Gig, Sysney, Tuesday night.
RE: Cityscape
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 10:13:16 +1000
From: Michael Ibrahim
> Please comment on your friends' response to Allan. I think it would
> be very interesting to see what verbal responses are evoked by Allan's
> music falling on novice ears. It would also be interesting to look at
> relations between a person's listening history and their verbal/emotional
> responses (likes/dislikes) to Allan's music (esp. the people that are into
> Boys-to-Men :)
Well, basically the general consensus was that the music was intersting, but
it was not the kind of thing that they were going to go back and see. It
involved "too much concentration" as one person put it. Another person said
that they felt like they spent the whole time frowning. I mentioned to Allan
that I was bringing along a whole bunch of people who had never heard him
before. He said words to the effect of "I wonder how may of them will be your
friends at the end of the night!"
The gig was brain melting as expected. Chad Wackermann was on drums, but I
don't know if he's just playing here in Australia or if he's doing the whole
tour. Chad was incredible. The last time Allan came out he had Gary Husband
with him. I felt that Gary was a bit too over-the-top. Chad on the other hand
is a bit more tasteful and "pulls back" when it's appropriate. Of all the
musicians, Chad went down best with the non-holdworthians, especially the
Boys-to-Men people (which I thought was interesting).
Anyway, better stop avoiding work. I'll keep you all posted on the other two
gigs.
Later
Miko.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 9 May 1995 20:43:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: Re: Comment on Roland Guitar Simulator
> From: Paolo Valladolid
> Subject: Re: Comment on Roland Guitar Simulator
> Perhaps the main
> issue with Allan might be that the VG8 responds *too much* like
> a guitar; he's really looking for a surrogate horn. For one thing,
> I don't think it has a breath controller.
Actually, I think the main issue with Allan is the fact that he no
longer HAS one to tinker with... Roland picked up the one he was using,
and he's heard nothing from them since (not even "Thanks for doing NAMM
and the demo video; you can buy one of these any time you like for
$nnnn.nn," etc.). But no matter -- the SynthAxe lives, thanks very
much to Stone Temple Pilots! :)
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 May 95 01:35:41 -0400
From: rardin%orion.dnet@auriga (R. Lynn Rardin)
Subject: RE: Gonzilla
>>I wanted to confirm the address for LOLO Records.
>>
>> P.O. Box 122 Riverton,
>> NJ 08077
>>
>> Is this correct?
>
>Yes. Also, other points of contact are:
>
>bonlo@delphi.com...
Tried sending mail to this email address and got the following error, so I
guess this isn't a good way to reach Lolo. :)
#banlo@delphi.com: Remote system's reason for rejecting: unknown or illegal
#user: banlo@delphi.com
-Lynn
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 01:54:10 -0400
From: MerdadP@aol.com
Subject: My first time with Allan
OK, just thought I'd add my $.02 re: my first exposure to Allan. I had been a
70's progressive rock kinda guy, so I sort of followed Bruford out of Yes and
King Crimson (old version with Fripp/Bruford/Wetton) to his solo stuff. To
this day I think Bruford's One Of A Kind album is one of the best albums
ever. Allan is amazing, not to mention Bruford and Jeff Berlin. If you can
get past some of the cheesy early 80's synth sounds (Dave Stewart does an
amazing job), you'll love this album's polyrhythms,etc. Highly rec (available
on EG CD's, at least it was). Ever since then, I've been a huge Holdsworth
fan. It was great to see him with Jeff Berlin (and CHAD!) with the Steve
Morse band as an opener (what a show). I'd still love to hear AH reunited, at
least for a couple of songs, with Jeff Berlin and Bruford--although I love
the current lineup (where's Chad?).
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 May 95 07:50:30 -0400
From: rardin%orion.dnet@auriga (R. Lynn Rardin)
Subject: Re: Gonzilla
>> >bonlo@delphi.com...
^
>> #banlo@delphi.com: Remote system's reason for rejecting: unknown or illegal
^
>> #user: banlo@delphi.com
^
>
> Oops. :)
Boy is my face red! :) Oddly enough, bonlo@delphi.com seems to work much
better. :)
-Lynn
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 08:37:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: Re: My first time with Allan
> From: MerdadP@aol.com
> Subject: My first time with Allan
> To
> this day I think Bruford's One Of A Kind album is one of the best albums
> ever.
Hear, hear! :)
> Allan is amazing, not to mention Bruford and Jeff Berlin. If you can
> get past some of the cheesy early 80's synth sounds (Dave Stewart does an
> amazing job), you'll love this album's polyrhythms,etc.
*Cheesy*? Gee, I wouldn't change a-one.
> --although I love
> the current lineup (where's Chad?).
He's on tour with Allan now, in Australia. Chad lives there now, and
will probably not be coming back to North America for the dates here,
but he's definitely behind the kit this week and next!
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 10:49:01 -0400
From: jerfo@student.umass.edu
Subject: Re: Bonlo?
>#banlo@delphi.com: Remote system's reason for rejecting: unknown or illegal
>#user: banlo@delphi.com
This could be worse...you could have sent it to this user:
bono@delphi.com
Your face would REALLY be red then! (Not to mention the confused
Irishman thrown into the mix.) :)
*Jerfo*
PS To everyone: Why did Chad move to Australia? It's not exactly the music
hub of the free world...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 08:07:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Mason
Subject: Re: Atavachron Digest Number 150
Hi,
As regards Don Gunn's comments about drum sounds etc., I do agree that
there've been some questionable results in that area on several of
Holdsworth's releases but, as with anything else musical, there's a lot
of personal taste involved.
My view is that, for example, on the I.O.U. album, the kit itself sounded
great, was abviously recorded very live in a nice "live" room and played
incredibly well, but the actual reproduction of the sound on vinyl is
somewhat lacking - there's the implication of great sound but not the
delivery ( I hope this makes sense - I sometimes have to do the
audio-engineering in my head as I'm listening, sort of re-E.Q.-ing as I
play the album to compensate for old, possibly inferior recordings. Metal
Fatigue, by comparison, delivered an amazing drum sound, at least in my
opinion - obviously a great drum sound from the kit, exceptionally played
and brilliantly engineered.
This, to me, is a different story fromthe Road Games album where, also
in my opinion, the drums sounded hopeless to begin with ( well, I mean,
they're made from wood!!...no wonder.... ) - and, as we all know, you can't
really fix it in the mix!!!
There are so many variables - the room, the player, the drums, the heads,
the sticks, the engineer's taste, etc. - I'm sure Holdsworth wound up
with what he was looking for ( even on Road Games.... ), and it is his
call, right?
Paul
P.S. Didn't Boyz-2-Men cover a Holdsworth tune on their last album? Or
was it a Motorhead piece - I sometimes have trouble telling them apart....
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 May 95 10:24:44 PDT
From: "Chris Manuel"
Subject: Revised Homepage
To: ATAVACHR--INTERNET atavachron@msuacad
Folks,
FYI - I finally got around to uploading the audio files for my homepage.
They're all in .au file format.
Chris Manuel
BC Systems Corporation, Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
cpmanuel@bcsc02.gov.bc.ca
http://eps.gov.bc.ca:3893/~cpmanuel/Chris/INDEX.HTML
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 13:42:02 -0400
From: Daniel Barrett
Subject: Ogerman/Brecker "Cityscapes" CD release
CITYSCAPES, an album by Claus Ogerman and Michael Brecker has
just been released on CD domestically (USA - Warner Brothers). For
those who are not aware of it, CITYSCAPES is one of Allan Holdsworth's
absolute favorite albums, as reported in a magazine interview a few
years ago.
Anybody know anything about the album? Recommendations?
Dan
//////////////////////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
| Dan Barrett -- Computer Science Dept, University of MA, Amherst, MA 01003 |
| http://zoo.cs.umass.edu/~barrett/public.html -- barrett@cs.umass.edu |
\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\/////////////////////////////////////
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 May 95 14:28:09 -0400
From: rardin%orion.dnet@auriga (R. Lynn Rardin)
Subject: RE: Cityscape
> CITYSCAPES, an album by Claus Ogerman and Michael Brecker has
>just been released on CD domestically (USA - Warner Brothers). For
>those who are not aware of it, CITYSCAPES is one of Allan Holdsworth's
>absolute favorite albums, as reported in a magazine interview a few
>years ago.
I'd say this is a must if you're a Brecker fan. Michael gets to stretch out
over Ogerman's rich orchestrations. I like this a lot.
-Lynn
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 11 May 1995 12:28:23 +1000
From: Andrew Studer
Subject: The Gig, Sysney, Tuesday night.
Well, went to se AH at the Basement on Tuesday; it was actually about a year
ago that he was last here, and it's pretty astonishing for ANY overseas
act to tour that frequently out here.
The place was full- not as full as last year, but full nonetheless.
Michael "80 characters a line" Ibrahim- the man I have the honour of
introducing to this list, managed to inveigle *18 PEOPLE* into coming along,
most of them were there on Tuesday. Now I'm not sure I KNOW 18 people, and
don't know how much chance I'd get of dragging any of them along. So I went
with my trusty drummer friend Sean, the man who introduced ME to AH via
"One of a Kind" (I was a Yes nut).
Set list was pretty much as per last time: Funnels, Pud Wud, House of Mirrors,
that other track off Atavachron with Tony Williams on drums, they played
"Zone", which was sort of interesting (does this track exist on any album,
or just the instruction tape?), Devil takes the Hindmost, the track off IOU
with the really cool ending (you can tell I really know my track titles),
encore was Proto- Cosmos.
Main difference was, of course, Chad on drums. FAR better than Gary "overplay"
Husband. Chad resisted the urge to hit EVERY PART OF HIS KIT ALL THE TIME
VERY LOUD KIND OF MONOTONOUS DON'T YOU THINK and let an element of (god
forbid) GROOVE enter the night's proceedings. As you can tell, I'm not a GH
fan. Anyway, Chad largely gave people space to do their thing, I thought
interplay between Skuli and Chad was good (presumably this is the first tour
they've played together?). I noticed after the show that Chad had charts to
play off- didn't seem to need them much. On the negative side, I thought his
drum solo was very ordinary- then again I might have been spoiled by seeing
Max Roach a few weeks ago.
So I basically enjoyed the show, Michael's legion of Boyz II Men fans seemed
a little fazed by the whole thing, but hey, at least most of them lasted until
the end (maybe they were relying on Mike for a lift home). Maybe someone's
musical boundaries were stretched on the night. You can only hope.
I still have the problem that I had last time with the show: that Alan
seems to have locked himself into an arrangement style which seems to be
restricting rather than freeing him. Most of the pieces follow a "head-solo-
solo-solo-head" format, and in a 90 minute show we get 10 minutes of tune and
80 minutes of solo. For me, the night's highlight was "House of Mirrors",
which had a (reasonably short) Steve Hunt solo, the rest was playing an
arrangement. And after a while, dare I say it, ALL THE SOLOS SOUND THE SAME.
Skuli launches into his triplet-eights-high-on-the-fretboard thing, Steve
plays 64-notes-to-the-bar, and even Alan, usually a fountaing of imagination,
was playing in a suprisingly repetitious fashion.
Some gossip from Michael: AH did a clinic on Wednesday, which he (Michael
that is) found excruciatingly embarrasing- lots of wanky musicians asking
a whole bunch of irrelevant technical questions. Apparently, AH is using all
borrowed equipment for this show, and is not happy with his sound at all.
Some of us noticed some tension between AH and SH on Tuesday- apparently,
last night, AH cut in on Steve's solo! I get the impression that AH is a
little unhappy doing this tour. Maybe the man needs a holiday.
A piece of gratuitous advice from a know- nothing fan: Alan, take a break.
Do something else for a few months and then pick up your axe. Play with other
musicians, and stuff around with your compositional style a bit. And stop
playing so bloody fast all the time: occasionally old fashioned ideas such
as melody are worth pursuing. Alan, you run the risk of playing to an ever
decreasing circle of musicians and fans, locked into the "clinic" style
tour. Slow down a bit and play something simple. Sometimes, appealing to the
highest common denominator is just as stifling as playing to the lowest.
Andrew
studer@physics.su.oz.au
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 11 May 1995 00:16:27 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: Re: The Gig, Sysney, Tuesday night. / Trial Balloon
> From: Andrew Studer
> Subject: The Gig, Sysney, Tuesday night.
> The place was full- not as full as last year, but full nonetheless.
> Michael "80 characters a line" Ibrahim- the man I have the honour of
> introducing to this list, managed to inveigle *18 PEOPLE* into coming along,
> most of them were there on Tuesday.
Give that man a medal!! :) That is above and beyond the call of duty!
> Main difference was, of course, Chad on drums. FAR better than Gary "overplay"
> Husband. Chad resisted the urge to hit EVERY PART OF HIS KIT ALL THE TIME
> VERY LOUD KIND OF MONOTONOUS DON'T YOU THINK and let an element of (god
> forbid) GROOVE enter the night's proceedings. As you can tell, I'm not a GH
> fan. Anyway, Chad largely gave people space to do their thing, I thought
> interplay between Skuli and Chad was good (presumably this is the first tour
> they've played together?).
Nope -- the first tour I saw in 1991 featured Chad behind the kit and
Skuli on bass.
Jeff
P.S. -- How do you folks feel about the possibility of moving
Atavachron to a commercial server (MY commercial server,
to be specific)? I have to admit I would probably not be
inclined to change the anti-bootlegging policy that is
currently in place, out of respect for Allan, but it might
(possibly -- just blue-skying here) lead to online ordering
of A.H. paraphenalia and recordings, etc. In any case, drop
me a line directly (no need to clog the list, eh?) if you
have any strong feelings about this -- one way or the other!
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 11 May 1995 12:50:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: X90LESAGE@wmich.edu
Subject: Re: The Gig, Sysney, Tuesday night.
Monontony was troublesome for me too the last time I saw Allan. The solos
started to all sound the same half-way through the gig, very disappointing.
After reading the post to which I'm replying, I realize that repetitive
song structure (head-solo-solo-head) does grind on me a bit. I wish Allan
would do more things like Hard Hat Area (the tune) wherein the compositional
structure metamorphizes a few times through the course of the tune (at least
that's how I recall HHA, it's been a while since I listened to that tune)
with less emphasis on blowing over changes. IMHO, Allan's main strength lies
in his command of simple melody woven through complex harmony. I simply melt
when I hear most of his beautiful chordal arrangements.
Best Regards,
Mark LeSage |
Department of Psychology | "...when [introspectionists] come to
Western Michigan University | analyze consciousness, naturally they find in
Kalamazoo, MI 49008 | it just what they put into it."
Tel: 616-387-4503 |
email: x90lesage@wmich.edu | J.B. Watson (1924, p. 4)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 11 May 1995 19:07:15 +0200
From: rene@via.nl (Rene Janssen)
Subject: RE: Cityscape
>> CITYSCAPES, an album by Claus Ogerman and Michael Brecker has
>>just been released on CD domestically (USA - Warner Brothers). For
>>those who are not aware of it, CITYSCAPES is one of Allan Holdsworth's
>>absolute favorite albums, as reported in a magazine interview a few
>>years ago.
>
>I'd say this is a must if you're a Brecker fan. Michael gets to stretch out
>over Ogerman's rich orchestrations. I like this a lot.
>
>-Lynn
>
Who are the other musicians on it ?
thanks,
Rene.
\/
Rene Janssen. /\
e-mail : rene@via.nl_______||__________________
WWW : http://www.via.nl/users/rene/rene.html
_______
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
========= End of Atavachron Digest ========= I
\ :::: ]I[ :::: /
Administrative requests to: : ::::::: ]] [[ ::::::: :
listserv@msuacad.morehead-st.edu ::: ]] [[ :::
''::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::''
Postings to: ::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
atavachron@msuacad.morehead-st.edu ::: =a=t=a=v=a=c=h=r=o=n= :::
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
For more info, send HELP as the first ,,::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::,,
line in e-mail to the listserv above. ::: ]] [[ :::
: :::::: ]] . [[ :::::: :
All opinions expressed herein are / :: ] ::: [ :: \
those of the individual contributors. I I
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tour Dates for Japan, Australia and more are available!
finger preston@msuacad.morehead-st.edu for the most current itinerary
Atavachron Digest - The Allan Holdsworth Discussion Digest
Number 154
Sunday, 21 May 1995
TODAY'S TOPICS:
==============
Re: Atavachron Digest Number 153
Re: CITYSCAPE
Re: One Of A Kind (was: My first time with Allan)
Speed Kills! (or at least bores...)
Re: solo after solo after solo
Re: solo after solo after solo
Allan in Sydney
Birchmere closing... (fwd)
We're still here; you're still here
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: dozier@titan.iwu.edu (Bill Dozier)
Subject: Re: Atavachron Digest Number 153
Date: Thu, 11 May 1995 13:43:48 -0600 (CDT)
> > Please comment on your friends' response to Allan. I think it would
> > be very interesting to see what verbal responses are evoked by Allan's
> > music falling on novice ears. It would also be interesting to look at
> > relations between a person's listening history and their verbal/emotional
> > responses (likes/dislikes) to Allan's music (esp. the people that are into
> > Boys-to-Men :)
>
> Well, basically the general consensus was that the music was intersting, but
> it was not the kind of thing that they were going to go back and see. It
> involved "too much concentration" as one person put it. Another person said
> that they felt like they spent the whole time frowning. I mentioned to Allan
> that I was bringing along a whole bunch of people who had never heard him
> before. He said words to the effect of "I wonder how may of them will be your
> friends at the end of the night!"
I had a similar (I think) response when I dragged a couple of friends out to
the Roxy during the IOU tour. Both were big prog-rock & fusion fans, so I
expected them to like AH. However, I think Allan's unusual choice of chord
changes was a little too much for them. After the show, one of them said,
"There were so many unresolved suspended chords that I think the Roxy will
still be floating over Sunset BL tomorrow morning!"
Another similar experience: I took a date to a Dregs concert. She was a
music major (piano) that also liked what was then called "New Wave" rock.
Her reaction was, "Does *everyone* have to solo in *every* song?"
> Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 08:37:26 -0400 (EDT)
> From: Jeff Preston
> Subject: Re: My first time with Allan
>
> > From: MerdadP@aol.com
> > Subject: My first time with Allan
>
> > To
> > this day I think Bruford's One Of A Kind album is one of the best albums
> > ever.
>
> > Allan is amazing, not to mention Bruford and Jeff Berlin. If you can
> > get past some of the cheesy early 80's synth sounds (Dave Stewart does an
> > amazing job), you'll love this album's polyrhythms,etc.
>
> *Cheesy*? Gee, I wouldn't change a-one.
>
This is the one album I have that I would not want a single note changed
anywhere. Everything about it is perfection and the only thing wrong with it
is that it has to end.
Bill
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 11 May 95 14:53:59 -0400
From: rardin%orion.dnet@auriga (R. Lynn Rardin)
Subject: Re: CITYSCAPE
>>> CITYSCAPES, an album by Claus Ogerman and Michael Brecker...
>>
>>I'd say this is a must if you're a Brecker fan. Michael gets to stretch out
>>over Ogerman's rich orchestrations. I like this a lot.
>
>Who are the other musicians on it ?
Warren Bernhardt, Steve Gadd, Paulinho da Costa, Buzzy Feiten and a couple
others.
-Lynn
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 11 May 95 14:57:30 -0400
From: rardin%orion.dnet@auriga (R. Lynn Rardin)
Subject: Re: One Of A Kind (was: My first time with Allan)
>> > To this day I think Bruford's One Of A Kind album is one of the best albums
>> > ever.
>>
>> > Allan is amazing, not to mention Bruford and Jeff Berlin. If you can
>> > get past some of the cheesy early 80's synth sounds (Dave Stewart does an
>> > amazing job), you'll love this album's polyrhythms,etc.
>>
>> *Cheesy*? Gee, I wouldn't change a-one.
>>
>This is the one album I have that I would not want a single note changed
>anywhere. Everything about it is perfection and the only thing wrong with it
>is that it has to end.
Let me third or fourth that! OOAK kicks. This is some of my favorite of
Allan's work.
-Lynn
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 11 May 95 16:08:10 PDT
From: "Chris Manuel"
Subject: Speed Kills! (or at least bores...)
To: ATAVACHR--INTERNET atavachron@msuacad
I've been followning the posts from Australia with a great deal of interest.
I'm particularly interested in the boredom thread that's appeared. I remember
going quite glassy-eyed when I watch AH in Toronto (awhile ago - late
eighties). He played really well but after awhile the solos started to blur
together. I find the same thing happens when I see bebop players - initially
it's really exciting to hear the long cascades of notes but after awhile
you're left wanting something different.
So why is this? Time for a theory ...
Let's blame television! We're all so used to the channel flicker that we need
MAXIMUM STIMULATION at every moment.
I'm joking, I'm joking. TV is really your friend, and I would never attack a
friend.
Actually I think a lot of what is going on is just a reflection of the level
of intellectual commitment necessary to "stay with" the performer when they're
working such a complex improvisational vein. One of the reasons a Pat Metheny
concert offers fewer glassy eyes is the compositional range of the Group, but
especially the timbral range. Metheny plays a lot of different sounding
guitars through the evening, and tends to change his solo structures to
reflect the instrument. His GR 300 playing is usually much busier and more
strident; his classical solos (sorry, solos on classical guitar) are usually
very spare and open. When AH was touring with the SynthAxe his timbral range
was widened a great deal, although his sound on the SynthAxe kept to a pretty
narrow (classic Oberheim) range of sounds.
I'm hoping that when the Man gets to Vancouver he will have the DeLapps (sp?),
the new SynthAxe and the trusty Steinberger to keep me awake.
Thoughts?
Chris Manuel
BC Systems Corporation, Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
cpmanuel@bcsc02.gov.bc.ca
http://eps.gov.bc.ca:3893/~cpmanuel/Chris/INDEX.HTML
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 May 1995 17:07:51 +1000
From: Andrew Studer
Subject: Re: solo after solo after solo
Mark LeSage commented that he too is tiring of the head-solo-solo-head
structure and then said:
>I wish Allan
>would do more things like Hard Hat Area (the tune) wherein the compositional
>structure metamorphizes a few times through the course of the tune
Yes! Exactly! I really like the HHA album because it has a variety of moods
and song constructions in it. The title track has a very "non- linear" feel
to it and I think Alan sounds really good playing over the sequenced stuff.
I'd like to hear him do this sort of thing live (but it means more gear, so
it's probably more trouble than it's worth).
>IMHO, Allan's main strength lies
>in his command of simple melody woven through complex harmony.
And this is the key: if you can put some sort of melodic construction through
the fast stuff, then it really gives the whole thing a context. Alan is a
superb melody writer (I refer to House of Mirrors again), and I'd like to see
more of this. Can I make a really BIZARRE comparison: listen to Chopin's
etudes. Whole piles of notes at a speed that would fluster most shred
guitarists, but not hard to listen to at all because the listener always has
something to grasp onto.
Incidentally, Michael tells me that at Thursday's show, the band appeared
much more relaxed. They took a break (Tue and Wed they just played straight
through) which seemed beneficial to band and audience both, and really
burned. So there you go.
Andrew
studer@physics.su.oz.au
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 May 95 12:54:37 EDT
From: Daniel Ginsberg
Subject: Re: solo after solo after solo
I agree with Chris, and it is not a phenomenon unique to the Jazz idiom.
I recall a concert at Yale a few years back where a Webern piece was
being performed and it just took lots of concentration to follow and
appreciate the piece. It didn't help that a bunch of Yalies were yapping
through the entire piece.... I think that it is significant that the
band seemed tightly wound, though. Nothing swings when the musicians are
snappy with one another (and cutting in on one anothers solos!!)
Best,
Dan
dginsber@uconnvm.uconn.edu
ps: Chris: I still don't have anything worthwhile to say about ZTSF.
What an odd project......
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 13 May 1995 16:12:54 +1000 (EST)
From: Roger Douglas
Subject: Allan in Sydney
Just thought I'd add my 2 cents to the discussion. My son and I sat,
literally, at the master's feet on Wednesday night, at a table right next
to the stage and directly in front of Allan. The only problem with being
this close at the Basement is that the PA speakers are right above you
and you actually get the sound direct from the stage equipment. We
got a good mix of guitar and drums but the bass and keys were a bit low.
It was a great opportunity, though, to watch Allan's technique close up
and cop a look at his equipment. I notice he was using 2 Intellifex effects
processors, to get that lovely shimmering chorus sound, with a volume pedal
to get that very slow attack in the chord passages. He has a very battered
Cornish custom footswitch to switch the effects in and out. I'm not sure
whether he was using both effects units or if one was just a standby.
An interesting point - one of the units in his rack looked like it might
be a Harness (i.e it had something like the word Harness written across
the front - it was sort of sideways-on to me and I couldn't read it
clearly). Is it possible he would use the Harness for live playing? Did
any of you other guys who went to the gigs notice this?
I've read many comments about Allan's use the "whammy bar", but in fact
his guitar actually didn't have the whammy bar fitted. On the few
occasions where he used a "whammy" effect (what is the correct term for
this?) he just pushed or pulled on the microtuners on the tail-end of the
bridge, which overhang the cut-away bottom end of his guitar. He uses
this technique very sparingly. What he does do, a lot, is string bending
and finger vibrato. He often uses the old blues trick of giving the
last note of a phrase a quarter tone bend up before cutting the note off.
This all contributes to the slightly horn-like quality of his sound, I
guess. Sorry if this is all well-known stuff - I'm a newbie as far as AH
is concerned.
Someone mentioned an incident where he cut in on Steve Hunt's solo.
There was, clearly, some sort of cock-up (though I didn't notice it)
because at the end of the tune Allan turned to the others and said "What
happened? Something happened?" The others sort of shrugged it off, and he
said "Sorry about that", and carried on. There didn't seem to be any sort of
tension between them as far as I could see.
I agree with the comments made about (a) Chad fitting in better than Gary
Husband (b) a degree of monotony in the set. Looking back on it, it was
technically brilliant but never really "cooking", though Allan and Steve
seemed to be really getting into it on a couple of solos. I wonder if the
guys are a bit jaded with basically playing the same style and repertoire
over a long period.
Regards,
Roger
=====
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 15 May 1995 14:15:15 -0400 (EDT)
From: Adam Levin
Subject: Birchmere closing... (fwd)
This is where Holdsworth is (was?) supposed to play.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Mon, 15 MAY 1995 00:46:48 GMT
From: Larry Larson
Newgroups: rec.music.folk, dc.music
Subject: Birchmere closing...
For all the folkies and bluegrass types in the Washington, D.C.
area, a local trade paper ran an article last week which
contained the results of an interview with Gary Oelze, owner
of the Birchmere. He stated that he has been unable to resolve
disagreements over his lease with the owner of the
property where the Birch is located, and plans to close the
club. There was no mention of a possible new location. Does
anyone have any more detailed information, such as a
prospective closing date?
-- Larry
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 May 1995 00:19:37 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: We're still here; you're still here
Since a number of people have written to ask about the list in the
past few days, I just want to say that yes, the list is up, operating,
fine, okey-dokey, etc., and no one has been mistakenly unsubscribed.
Central Kentucky was beset with tornadoes, high winds and thunderstorms
on Thursday morning, and the campus power and telecomm lines here at
MSU have been spotty ever since. Needless to say, the webserver was
also down (until about 10:30 p.m. Saturday), so anyway, we're back.
Other than that, everyone should keep in mind that this is a
traditionally slow time of year for Atavachron, since a lot of
students here in the U.S. are done with school until late August,
so for you digest subscribers, it may well go two weeks between
digests due to the lack of traffic. If it goes longer than that, get
in touch with me and I'll make sure you're subscribed, but please, do
give it that long.
New addition to the webserver: Pros and Cons of moving Atavachron
to the new server (and I just thought of another one tonight: I think
I will want to do away with the direct mail version and go with a
straight digest-only; less than 20% of you now subscribe to the direct
mail list, and since I may well be administering the list via long
distance modem calls, I may *need* to limit it to digest-only).
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I ========= End of Atavachron Digest =========
\ :::: ]I[ :::: /
: ::::::: ]] [[ ::::::: : Administrative requests to:
::: ]] [[ ::: listserv@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
''::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::''
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ ::: Postings to:
::: =a=t=a=v=a=c=h=r=o=n= ::: atavachron@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
,,::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::,, For more info, send HELP as first
::: ]] [[ ::: line in e-mail to the listserv above.
: :::::: ]] . [[ :::::: :
/ :: ] ::: [ :: \ All opinions expressed herein are
I I those of the individual contributors.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tour Dates for Japan, Australia and more are available!
finger preston@msuacad.morehead-st.edu for the most current itinerary
Atavachron Digest - The Allan Holdsworth Discussion Digest
Number 155
Friday, 26 May 1995
TODAY'S TOPICS:
==============
Solo you can't no mo (boring solos?)
Re: Solo you can't no mo (boring solos?)
An analysis of boredom
Engineering at CMP
It's the MELODY, stupid!
(none)
It's the MELODY, stupid!
Why not Santa Cruz ?
Re: We're still here; you're still here
Re: An analysis of boredom
More changes to the AtavWWW
Sound file for the WWW! Yeehaw!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 May 1995 05:49:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: cmcdonald@sunbelt.net (Chip McDonald)
Subject: Solo you can't no mo (boring solos?)
I think alot of this phenomenon has to do with how long the act plays. I
think I've been to some AH shows where there wasn't an opening act, and he's
played for a very long time (I assume out of deference for the paying
audience member). Although he took a break in the middle, the impact of the
playing was lessened well before the first break.
I thought about how I felt - I conciously thought "man, listen to
him, he's really reaming", but I found it hard to concentrate. After the
break, it seemed fresh again.
I decided that what was happening is that there must be a
physiological phenomenon going on. When I go to see him play, I'm in what I
call "sponge mode" - everyone here knows what I'm talking about. It's like
your're doing a solo, and your're aware of every little nuance you do - this
is probably brought on in conjunction with the release of adrenalin. In
this state, you notice very minute details - pick attack differences, events
that take place on a less than millisecond level. Maybe it's like doubling
your brain's clock speed, so your sampling frequecny goes up.
Thing is, your body and mind probably starts shutting down after
being in this state after awhile. My theory is that you have a certain
reserve amount of time for any given amount of time.
AH is not in this state from start to finish. Where as you,
Atavachronistas, are perhaps scoping out fingerings for the heads of tunes,
he's played them hundreds of times. In other words, he's not (what I and a
friend calls it) "folding space" constantly, he's got breaks.
I think it's a concentration problem. Obviously, you're not
actually bored, or else you wouldn't ever listen to AH again. The part of
your mind that keeps you focused lets go, and you're not processing what
your're hearing at a level of efficiency high enough to appreciate the
subtleties of an AH solo.
I'm sure there's studies and research that's been done on the human
attention span being related to the amount of concentration *expected* of
the activity being pursued. This would explain why one feels so exausted
after an hour long set of playing music, which is basically just standing,
but mentally ultra involved. This may also explain why people who play less
mentally demanding music, although perhaps more active on stage, still have
enough energy after the gig to pursue groupies and throw televisions out of
hotel windows.
This may also explain why the more droll pop music is, the more
repeatable it becomes on the radio.
Or, I could be completeley wrong. Maybe AH needs to grow his hair
out and take "hair dancing" lessons from Megadeth. Naw...
I wouldn't mind if he took two shorter breaks instead of one at
these long shows - but no matter what - I like the long shows and prefer
one break to shorter set.
Chip McDonald / cmcdonald@sunbelt.net | Holdsworth-Floyd-Kate-Sarah
"Try to be reasonable whenever possible" | Garden-Niven-WGibson-Marshall
"I too, have been ripped off by Atlanta Rhythm City"| Ibanez-Boogie-ADA-No
CFR/TC
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 May 95 12:52:08 EDT
From: Daniel Ginsberg
Subject: Re: Solo you can't no mo (boring solos?)
Chip,
Well said, and i could't agree more.
Dan
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 21 May 1995 14:28:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: X90LESAGE@wmich.edu
Subject: An analysis of boredom
Let me warn you that this is a very long post. I was in the mood to write,
so I did. Moreover, the analyses below are VERY abbreviated. If people what
to discuss details, I would be happy to provide a more thoroughgoing account.
Let me make an opinionated start by saying this: I am not a fan of
mentalistic analyses of anything. Mind/body distinctions play no role in a
USEFUL analysis of anything. Such analyses invent causes of behavior. Such
inventions are useless because they are unobservable and, thus,
unfalsifiable. As a scientist, I have no tolerance for unfalsifiable
constructs, nor the dogmatic following they evoke. Let's just look at the
empirical findings shall we? They are the only things we can truely trust
because they are publicly verifiable (i.e., we can all see them with our own
eyes). So let's look at the boredom to which several of us have been
refering.
The observable evidence of AH-solo boredom is the shift in one's attention
from the music (solo) to other things. One begins to listen to the bass,
drums, keys, friend's converstation, or stops listening altogether and starts
looking at equipment, watching people in the bar, etc.. So, why does such a
change in behavior take place? Prior to the gig, the sound of Allan's music
has become, for lack of better nontechnical terms (because there are none), a
very potent reinforcer (i.e., reward). The processes by which the sound of
music becomes so may be complicated and, thus, beyond the scope of the present
analysis. But, to make it simple, it may be that one has been deprived of
live AH music for a sufficient period of time so as to make AH music very
rewarding when it is finally heard. So, going into the gig, the first chord
AH plays turns you to jello (i.e., it's awesome). Likewise, the first solo
sends your head spinning and you smile and cheer in the wonderment of it all.
I trust you all know what I'm talking about :)
Such auditory stimulation elicits emotional responses and evokes complete
attention toward the source. A vast research literature in experimental
psychology with humans and nonhumans alike provides us with data upon which
we can base a prediction of what will take place if the auditory stimulation
does not vary significantly over time/trials (songs in our case). Minimal
variance in stimulation results in a decrease in magnitude of emotional
responding and a decrease in frequency of attentive behavior controlled by
the source (conversely, an increase in the control of attentive behavior
by other stimuli).
Your absolutly right, this is just a technical way of describing what we've
all seen. That's the beauty of it. The relationship described above has
no refercence to invented, superflous, mental baggage. This is probably
unsettling to many. But the analysis suggests a now obvious and straight-
forward way (but not necessarily easy for or important to Allan) of solving
the listener's problem. The music must change, not the minds of the listeners.
Sufficient variance in the solos will maintain attention for longer periods of
time. That's about all there is to it (a book could be written on the details).
Of course, there are individual differences on attention span in this sort of
situation. Such differences could be accounted for in several ways. A
couple of obvious ones are a) relative levels of AH deprivation and b)
relative size of the music performing/listening repertoire [Those individuals
that have more experience listening to/playing AH or similar sophisticated
music will have a longer attention span. But the difference is between
individuals' behavioral sophistication, not mental sohistication.]
Two fundamental behavioral principles are at play: habituation and
satiation. Emotional responses habituate (decrease) upon repeated exposure
to stimuli; the more variable the stimuli (in frequency, amplitude, etc.),
the longer the emotional response can be maintained. Attention wanes as one
satiates on the reward for doing so (the sound of AH music in this case).
That is, a music deprived person will stop listening to music once the level
of deprivation has sufficiently decreased. [The process is identical to
discontinuing food consumption when one becomes full (satiated on food).]
Attention can be maintained for longer periods of time if the reward for doing
so is varied sufficiently. [Note: levels of sufficiency need to be
determined empirically on an individual basis. One needs to adjust levels of
variation to determine the optimal level that maintains listening. In other
words, you can't predict a priori what level of variation will be sufficient
to maintain attention. You have to experiment.]
Congratulations!! You made it all the way through the post. Hope it was
intellectually worth it :)
Unintentionally pretentiously yours,
Mark LeSage |
Department of Psychology | "...when [introspectionists] come to
Western Michigan University | analyze consciousness, naturally they find in
Kalamazoo, MI 49008 | it just what they put into it."
Tel: 616-387-4503 |
email: x90lesage@wmich.edu | J.B. Watson (1924, p. 4)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: barryk@lhl.lib.mo.us (Ken Barry)
Subject: Engineering at CMP
Date: Sun, 21 May 1995 23:19:22 -0600
Something I noticed...
I was listening to Trilok Gurtu's _Living Magic_ (?) album, and i noticed
that it sounded like the engineer just got some new stuff ("hey look! I can
change the delay time by twisting this knob here...") and was kind of
intrigued by the way all this was being very obviously used on the album.
So, when I read here that AH was displeased by the addition of effects and
stuff on the Chad Wackerman _The View_ album, well, things seemed to make
more sense. I thought it was kind of out of character for him to add
gratuitous effects on his solos.
What's this guy at CMP records think he's doing??? The label seems to have
the coolest jazz players on it, but damn, if that engineer is going to keep
putting his own "commentary" on other people's stuff....
-----------------------------------------------------------
Ken Barry Technical & Automated Services
Linda Hall Library
barryk@lhl.lib.mo.us 5109 Cherry St.
http://www.sky.net/~kennyb/ Kansas City, MO 64110
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 May 1995 09:27:17 -0500 (EST)
From: tAKE oNE
Subject: It's the MELODY, stupid!
[Moderator's note: I've added some characters to this post to keep the
dreaded "leading 'From'" problem from occuring; apologies to all those
who saw this (albeit in two pieces) before. --JP]
All:
[Reading over this, I realize I sound like a chatty drunk. I'm just
trying to stimulate discussion. Flames cheerfully refunded!]
>I'm particularly interested in the boredom thread that's appeared. I remember
>going quite glassy-eyed when I watch AH in Toronto (awhile ago - late
>eighties). He played really well but after awhile the solos started to blur
>together.
And I thought it was just me. ;^)
---> From the time I heard "Non-brewed Condiment" off a Guitar Player
magazine "soundsheet" (anyone else miss those things?), I was
officially hooked. Bought every record (and I do mean vinyl) faithfully
up through "Secrets."
Then had a drastic change of life and music and fell face-forward
into grunge/rock. (Really--laugh if you must.) Some odd Pearl Jam,
Nirvana, STP, Tool, and Afghan Whigs CDs later, I figured I should
try to get better balanced, so I finally picked up "Hard Hat Area."
You know what I think's missing from Allan's music, right now?
It's what enables everybody to be able to hum along with
"Heart-Shaped Box." It's that thing Pat Metheny's so good at.
It's MELODY.
Think about it: how many guitar mag interviews have you read where
players are saying, "If you can't play the damn melody, you're not
playing at all!" (or words to that effect). I can hum the lines to
"City Nights," "Funnels," and "The Unmerry-go-round" (well, the middle
part, anyway) without undue brain trauma.
I'm not saying give up the shredding, I'm just saying compliment
solo over a SONG, not just some pretty chords. Maybe that's lowest
common denominator music. Maybe that doesn't appeal to a jazz
purist. Maybe that's a sellout; I don't care.
[For a transcript of this maniacal rave, send $2 to "Hot Air
Productions," along with a current photo and sushi preference.]
[PS - As always, thanks to Jeff for maintaining the shrine. Whatever
you wanna' do, server-wise is allright by me.]
andre' (who mostly lurks, but does listen)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 May 1995 11:40:10 -0700
From: Peter Guilhamet
Subject: Why not Santa Cruz ?
This is the first Holdsworth tour in many years to not touch down
in Santa Cruz, CA (Kuuwumba Jazz Center); anyone know why ?
We love him here, and always fill up two shows (early and late)
when he comes around. Is he unhappy with the past crowd reaction ?
Booking problems ? Venue too small (living room size) ?
If I can get this request through to him, it would be great.
Allan, please come back to play in Santa Cruz !!!
thx -pg-
p.s. I will drive up to see him in S.F. this year
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Paul Morris"
Date: Mon, 22 May 1995 23:07:57 +0000
Subject: Re: We're still here; you're still here
Thanks Jeff for the info and for clearing up a few questions as to
the whereabouts of the digest lately. A lot of effort and time goes
into your "keeper of the flame" responsibilities vis a vis the AH
list/digest/home page etc and it's greatly appreciated. Thanx once
again.
Paul
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Paul Morris"
Date: Mon, 22 May 1995 22:59:24 +0000
Subject: Re: An analysis of boredom
That was quite a mouthful! Now, let's cut to the chase: Aside from
all the heretofore presented analysis, what do you think of the
previously posted comments about "the melody" and song structure vis
a vis AH's playing? Myself, altho' I appreciate musical virtuosity
and technical expertise as much as anyone {especially having played
various instruments}, I find if it's coupled with a good melody, that
provides the variableness I believe, was alluded to in the post by M.
LeSage. After all, melody varies from song ot song and thus can
provide a framework to be inventive in soloing improvisation.
Everyone has their own style - AH differs from Al DiMeola or Pat
Metheny, or Terje Rypdal or George Benson; but just as it is good
that such variety in perforing styles is available I think you'd
agree that the more "popular' ones integrate their musicianship with
tunes htat stick in your mind and that you find yourself humming or
singing after the live concert experience is passe.
Thanks
Paul
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 May 1995 09:04:51 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: More changes to the AtavWWW
I've made a couple more changes to the Web pages, most notably in
the FAQ. The FAQ "index" at the top of the document now has a hypertext
link directly to the answer to the question within the FAQ document
itself, and at the end of nearly every answer, there's a small GIF
which, when clicked, will take you to the top of the appropraite
section of the "index." Am I making sense? :) Well, if not, go
take a quick look and tell me what you think... I hope this has
improved the functionality of the FAQ, and will get some of you old-
timers who've not looked at the FAQ in a while to re-visit it (and
suggest additions for it, of course). :)
Thanks for reading,
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 25 May 1995 16:28:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: Sound file for the WWW! Yeehaw!
Thanks entirely to Mike Uchima, we'll actually have some .au files
of Allan's tunes *on the Web tomorrow*. Yep, that's right. Right now,
we just have fifteen files -- all excerpts of Allan's soloing from
each of his releases. But that's progress! Mike says as soon as he
gets that case of Sierra Nevada Pale Ale, he'll do a few more for us.
So come on, y'all -- pony up! ;)
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
========= End of Atavachron Digest ========= I
\ :::: ]I[ :::: /
Administrative requests to: : ::::::: ]] [[ ::::::: :
listserv@msuacad.morehead-st.edu ::: ]] [[ :::
''::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::''
Postings to: ::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
atavachron@msuacad.morehead-st.edu ::: =a=t=a=v=a=c=h=r=o=n= :::
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
For more info, send HELP as the first ,,::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::,,
line in e-mail to the listserv above. ::: ]] [[ :::
: :::::: ]] . [[ :::::: :
All opinions expressed herein are / :: ] ::: [ :: \
those of the individual contributors. I I
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tour Dates for Japan, Australia and more are available!
finger preston@msuacad.morehead-st.edu for the most current itinerary
Atavachron Digest - The Allan Holdsworth Discussion Digest
Number 156
Sunday, 28 May 1995
TODAY'S TOPICS:
==============
Guitar as Melody Instrument
boredom ?
CMP
Re: boredom ?
Allan's Works
Yet another boring post about things being boring.
Re: Atavachron Digest Number 155
Artistic plateaus / more WWW news
I come not to bury AH..... (sound design)
Oneness...digest only...boredom
Re: Oneness...digest only...boredom
Re: Oneness...digest only...boredom
Re: Oneness...digest only...boredom
Re: Melody & Boredom
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Richard Huddleston
Date: Fri, 26 May 1995 09:26:20 -0400
Subject: Guitar as Melody Instrument
This post is probably borderline off-topic, but it's going to the best
set of thoughtful guitarists I know of. So there.
I've only been to two live music events where my eyes didn't glaze over
at some point--or where I didn't actually catch myself nodding off during
the show. One was the "Mysterious Traveller" tour of Weather Report, and
the other was the "Birds of Fire" tour of the Mahavishnu Orchestra--both
in the early 1970s. In both cases, it took me a couple of days to get my
jaw off the ground.
One part of the problem, I think, is that in most cases the timbre range
and harmonic characteristics of the performance sort of flatten out,
statistically. This has already been written about, and there isn't much
to add.
Another part of the problem is that some instruments, guitar among them,
just aren't typically played in a way that makes a single-line melody (or
solos, after your brain has gotten past the "Oh-My-God-That's-So-Incredible"
phase) sound particulary compelling. I can only think of two guitarists that
do a good job with melody, and unfortunately Allan isn't one of them.
Jeff Beck uses constantly shifting timbre, and sophisticated phrasing,
to explore a melody. He can only do this in the studio, however; live,
those timbre shifts just don't carry--at least, not in the larger halls
that Jeff usually plays in.
Pat Metheny uses a very "singing-like" dynamic to his melodies and solos.
When you listen to a good vocalist, you notice all sorts of subtleties
that the voice naturally provides (particularly the ease in varying the
volume of a particular point in a phrase). That kind of variance is
incredibly difficult to capture on a guitar, but Pat has largely managed
to do it.
It's the thing that has frustrated me the most over some 27 years of
playing guitar; the technical problems of playing disappear after about
10 years of consistent effort (less for many people). The problem
that remains is one of overcoming a basic characteristic of the guitar:
at its core, it's not a single-line instrument.
Richard
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 26 May 1995 09:03:38 -0500
From: Mike Coughlin
Subject: boredom ?
just my 2 cents here...
i too (can't believe i'm saying this) have experienced the boredom
factor at some recent tours. my feeling though is that the problem is
with steve hunt. i think he's really good but his solos sound way too
much like allan's to me. after having allan shred your face off it's
kind of hard to get excited about a solo that not only sounds the
same but is hidden behind a keyboard. the visual stimulus is gone &
you're walking up the same path. i never seemed to have this problem
with the trio shows or with kei akagi, who has a more percussive
style than steve.
that said, i will be flying up to toronto to see the show (and the
ponty, clarke & dimeola concert - woo-hoo !) and would naturally be
happy to meet up with any other attendees. i'll be the drunken
long-haired american with the atavachron t-shirt.
see ya
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Malcolm Humes
Subject: CMP
Date: Fri, 26 May 1995 09:09:09 -0700 (PDT)
barryk@lhl.lib.mo.us:
> What's this guy at CMP records think he's doing???
> The label seems to have the coolest jazz players on it, but damn, if that
> engineer is going to keep putting his own "commentary" on other people's
> stuff....
Isn't the engineer in question here also the guy who owns the label,
studio, etc. Not saying that justifies it. The guy at ECM has come
under similar criticism for over exerting his influence on recordings
on his label. But, looking at it compared to film or some other arts,
the producer or director (engineer) typically exerts influences and
jusdgments into the creative process - that's a prodcuer's role in
some folks minds. Look at Brian eno's prodction work, or Daniel Lanois,
or Phil Spector... many producers are known for adding a lot of their
own signature to the sound. In the case of CMP, I guess to me it's
only really relevant if the musicians really don't agree, but even taking
the film analogy again, and looking instead at Allan as actor or even
director, the studio paying the production costs would typically have
say over "final cut".
Personally, I don't like this view too much, the marginalization of music
into mere product or commodity annoys me. But as a musician myself I could
never hope to realize and release my music on a professional scale without
a benefactor; without someone paying the bills. It's hard to define what
rights that should give the producer in participating in the creative
process or in inserting his own vision into or over my work. In a lot
of scenarios musicians seek out what they perceive as a "good" prodcuer
with the hopes that they'll add their "touch".
By the way, with regard to Gurtu's music, I'd like to note that Trilok
is prone to using processing himself, at least in the times I've seen
him live, so it's quite possible he was involved in the production or
post-production of his own release and perhaps responsible for the knob
tweaking you notice. Also, though some other folks seem to prefer Living
Magic over it, I personally find Usfret to be Gurtu's most engaging release
yet.
- malcolm
mal@emf.net
http://www.emf.net/~mal/
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: russ@crosby.apl.washington.edu (Russ Light)
Subject: Re: boredom ?
Date: Fri, 26 May 1995 09:52:02 -0700 (PDT)
Mike Coughlin writes:
>
>that said, i will be flying up to toronto to see the show (and the
>ponty, clarke & dimeola concert - woo-hoo !) and would naturally be
>happy to meet up with any other attendees. i'll be the drunken
I have'nt heard about this tour. Are these guys playing in the same
band (ponty, clarke & dimeola)? Or what?
--
Thanks
Russ Light
Senior Electrical Engineer
(206) 543-1304 Office
(206) 543-1300 Main
(206) 543-6785 Fax
INTERNET: russ@apl.washington.edu
University of Washington
Applied Physics Laboratory (HN-10)
Attn: Russ Light
1013 NE 40th St
Seattle, Wa 98105
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 26 May 1995 15:02:05 EDT
From: jwu@uhavax.hartford.edu
Subject: Allan's Works
Hello all,
I'm quite new to Allan's works but I do have much of his stuff. I was
wondering if anyone out there could send me a list of all of his works.
I have a few of his solo albums like: Velvet Darkness, Atavachron, Secrets,
Wardenclyffe Tower, & Hard Hat Area...as well as Chad Wackerman's "The View"
(Which is an incredible album)....I'm mainly looking for his newer stuff--
not his 70's material.
Any help would be greatly appreciated! PLease send any info on Holdsworth
to: jwu@uhavax.hartford.edu
thanks so much!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 26 May 1995 17:03:07 -0400 (EDT)
From: cmcdonald@sunbelt.net (Chip McDonald)
Subject: Yet another boring post about things being boring.
To whom it may concern: I am not a scientist; yet, I don't feel one
needs to be to make a USEFUL observation. I personally think the Internet is
about communicating. Sorry.
Paul Morris" said
>a vis AH's playing? Myself, altho' I appreciate musical virtuosity
>and technical expertise as much as anyone {especially having played
>various instruments}, I find if it's coupled with a good melody, that
>provides the variableness I believe, was alluded to in the post by M.
>LeSage. After all, melody varies from song ot song and thus can
>provide a framework to be inventive in soloing improvisation.
>
I agree - what musical artist is going to provide you with more
"variableness"? I believe AH's music can be one of the most mentally
intensive, if not *the* most intensive, musical experiences one can have.
It's a matter of a degree of concentration. No one studies for 2 1/2 hours
straight without a break - there's a reason we stop, we lose focus. We take
a break and come back fresh. Most of our entertainment as humans is geared
around experiences lasting less than 1 1/2 hours, often with breaks throughout.
Allan Holdsworth is my favorite guitarist. I have yawned at a show.
2001: A Space Odyssey is my favorite movie. I yawn when I watch it,
too.
About the only show I've ever been to without yawning is Pink Floyd.
Having said that, PF is emotionally demanding, but does not require nearly
as much concentration as an AH show - in other words, I don't think it's the
lasers, big screen, size, etc. that makes it that way, but the fact that
there are extended periods of time where the chords are just floating along
at a slow pace - your mind isn't constantly swallowing changes every second.
Whereas you know who probably has a 3:1 chord ratio relative to Gilmour.
That doesn't mean it's better, just different - and more mentally demanding.
I stand by my original post. He needs to play shorter sets, shorter
than what most bands would play, simply because his music *is* more mentally
intense. Maybe 3 30-35 minute sets. He could arrange for something
different to happen during breaks, things less mentally involving - like
maybe he could make a little 10 minute video about beer, bikes, or some
other topic he likes - and show that on a tv set at the front of the stage.
I something like this would be good from a break standpoint, and it would
also give AH another dimension.
I think there's a difference between "boredom" and "losing
concentration". I've lost my concentration at an AH show, but I'm not
exactly sure I've been "bored". I once went to a "poetry reading". I was
empirically bored at that time, I believe.
Chip "just a musician" McDonald
Chip McDonald / cmcdonald@sunbelt.net | Holdsworth-Floyd-Kate-Sarah
"Try to be reasonable whenever possible" | Garden-Niven-WGibson-Marshall
"I too, have been ripped off by Atlanta Rhythm City" | Ibanez-Boogie-ADA
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 26 May 1995 15:33:09 -0700
From: "Lance Kutchins"
Subject: Re: Atavachron Digest Number 155
This is another request for an AH Santa Cruz show. I also think all this talk of
boring solos and the like is hogwash, including any suggestions that the artist
must change in order to satisfy the limitations of his audience. My primary
respect for Mr. Holdsworth stems from the fact that he refuses to compromise his
art for the satisfaction of the masses. If more artists took this approach we
wouldn't have the culturally deprived ears that we do. Todays topic would also
cease to be an issue. The muse certainly doesn't spring from the lowest common
denominator. Would you hire a plummer to do your dental work? Sounds like there
are plenty of plummers willing to give Allan a few guitar lessons.
peace.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 26 May 1995 19:11:45 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: Artistic plateaus / more WWW news
> From: Lance Kutchins
> Subject: Re: Atavachron Digest Number 155
> This is another request for an AH Santa Cruz show.
Sorry, Lance... I doubt if it's gonna happen this tour, if we haven't
heard by now.
> I also think all this talk of
> boring solos and the like is hogwash, including any suggestions that the
> artist
> must change in order to satisfy the limitations of his audience. My primary
> respect for Mr. Holdsworth stems from the fact that he refuses to compromise
> his
> art for the satisfaction of the masses.
I can see both sides of the debate, and I do think the debate itself
is healthy. I have to admit that one of the reasons I'm so glad to
hear Allan's involvement in projects other than his own is so I can
hear him in less familiar settings. I think he adapts so readily to
other forms *so well* that it *does* sometimes puzzle me that he
doesn't seem to be interested in exploring some of those avenues on
his own. I suppose that's why I'm so juiced about this upcoming
Beck/Willis/Covington release -- I want to hear what he can do with
this, essentially-unexplored (by him) territory.
ObAdminContent: To do justice to Mike Uchima's contributed sound
samples, I've done a little "spiffing-up" of the Web pages; remember,
use is encouraged, and feedback appreciated!
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 May 1995 13:10:35 +1000
From: Andrew Studer
Subject: I come not to bury AH..... (sound design)
Well, having seen this thread on solos take off- and making the obvious
comment that I'd rather be "bored" at an AH concert than anywhere else, I
just thought I'd make an observation in a more positive vein.
I'm listening to "Secrets" at the moment, and one thing which impresses me
about this- and all the other stuff- is the excellent sound design throughout.
The sounds are never boring or cliched. AH has a much better grasp on sound
design than most *keyboard* synthesists. Anyone have any fav. AH "sounds"?
(apart from his trademark guitar sound :-)). I love chordal sounds on
"City Nights". "Atavachron" (the track) is another fav.
Andrew
studer@physics.su.oz.au
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 May 1995 12:30:56 -0400
From: RickerRA@aol.com
Subject: Oneness...digest only...boredom
Please forgive if previously discussed...
A couple of months ago, I bought Andrea Marcelli's 'Oneness' believing it was
a 'new' recording. So, it surprised me when I found a Jap import of
'Oneness' that was copyrighted in 1992, and Andrea's liner notes include:
"... The music was recorded in Rio De Janeiro, Los Angeles, an New York
between August 1990 and October, 1991. ..."
Can anyone tell me if this was released in 1992, or what the story is?
About moving Atavachron to a commercial site...
The prospect of making AH related merchandise available via Atavachron sounds
like a cool idea. The only thing I've read thus far that bothers me is the
probable necessity of going 'digest only.' The problem I see with 'digest
only' newsletters is that questions and comments in one issue, often get
multiple and redundant answers and responses in the next issue.
About boredom...
I keep searching for find something cleaver to say about being bored reading
the recent boredom thread -- but the truth is, I've rather been fascinated by
it. I always thought I was a 'bad' Holdsworth fan when my mind would wander
during a performance. But I guess it's a little like finding yourself at an
open bar serving Sierra Nevada Pale Ale. The first sip is fantastic, and
three or four glasses latter, you're still rediscovering the nuances that
make you love this beer. But you're also starting to get a little
intoxicated. A couple of glasses further into the experience, it's still a
great beer, and you're still drinking, but your ability to appreciate it is
rather diminished from earlier in the evening.
Holdsworth is a drug, you know!
Reed Ricker
rickerra@aol.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 27 May 1995 13:42:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jeff Preston
Subject: Re: Oneness...digest only...boredom
> To: Multiple recipients of list
> Subject: Oneness...digest only...boredom
> Can anyone tell me if this was released in 1992, or what the story is?
Yeah, it's only been available domestically for about a year, I think.
Alex Merck of Lipstick Records is on the net, but I don't have his
e-mail address handy... write back to me if you'd like me to look it
up for you.
> About moving Atavachron to a commercial site...
> The prospect of making AH related merchandise available via Atavachron sounds
> like a cool idea. The only thing I've read thus far that bothers me is the
> probable necessity of going 'digest only.' The problem I see with 'digest
> only' newsletters is that questions and comments in one issue, often get
> multiple and redundant answers and responses in the next issue.
But that happens *now*, doesn't it? More than 5/6ths of the
subscribers are currently on the digest; do you really think adding
the remaining 50 subscribers to the digest will make this worse?
Jeff
--
Jeff Preston \\\ Moderator of the Allan Holdsworth discussion forum
to subscribe \\\ e-mail: atavachron-request@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
Web Page URL \\\ http://suppcoo.morehead-st.edu/atav/docs/home.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Paul Morris"
Date: Sat, 27 May 1995 15:26:23 +0000
Subject: Re: Oneness...digest only...boredom
Jeff,
In a word, "no".
esponse to Chip's post, I'd like to add a hearty amen to that.
We need to differentiate between losing concentration momentarily and
boredom. It was a good observation. His point about PF was well
taken as well - each concert experience is different and provides
different demands on the listeners. AH is an excellent
guitarist/performer but we appreciate this without expecting him to
be someone other than himself. I must admit that perhaps a similar
comment-vein, from my point of view, is found in comparing Al
DiMeola's music of the early period (the '70's and early '80's) wiht
that of the period since. I, personally, find my
concentration/appreciation of the latter period to be far less than
the early period. This is not to say that he has "lost it", but
rather that perhaps he needs to incorporate a fresh approach [he
seems in a rut]. AH is not in the same situation, but I was
referring to those who say that they prefer "Hard Hat" era or some
other one than the present. Maybe it's just a matter of our culture
where we experience such an avalanche of input that we become
overwhelmed and/or easily jaded. Perhaps it's like the "needing a
new thrill" syndrome because we have become blase. We should try to
appreciate each experience on it's own merits - easier said than
done.
Thanks and peace,
Paul
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 May 1995 02:43:57 -0400
From: hiroomi@panix.com (Hiroomi Nakazawa)
Subject: Re: Oneness...digest only...boredom
Mr.Reed Ricker said,
>A couple of months ago, I bought Andrea Marcelli's 'Oneness' believing it was
>a 'new' recording. So, it surprised me when I found a Jap import of
>'Oneness' that was copyrighted in 1992, and Andrea's liner notes include:
>.....
And Mr. Jeff Preston said,
>Yeah, it's only been available domestically for about a year, I think.
> Alex Merck of Lipstick Records is on the net, but I don't have his
>......
I moved to NYC from Yokohama(Japan) due to my job in August 1992.
I am subscribing 'Jazz Life' (Japanese magazine) and I found that
'Oneness' was released on 10/25/92 in Japan (Verve Forest POCJ-1141)
on 'Jazz Life' Nov '92 issue. Since then I checked many CD shops in NYC
and asked a staff to check if it is released. But they could find only
'Silent Will'
on a Catalog book. I thought it has been available only in Japan. So I am really
glad that Lipstick Records released 'Oneness' in U.S.
BTW, I will go to IMAC (Huntington NY) and BottomLine(NYC) in July.
I am wondering if I could see some of Atavacron subscribers at a club
and talk much more (though I am not good at English) about Mr.AH and ourselves.
If some of my neighbers are interested in this idea, please send e-mail
directly to me.
Hiroomi Nakazawa
hiroomi@panix.com
New York, NY
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 May 1995 20:07:17 -0400
From: KingsleyD@aol.com
Subject: Re: Melody & Boredom
Greetings, all!
Very interesting thread regarding attention and boredom at AH concerts. I've
certainly experienced similar responses to AH shows, and have always felt
that certain aspects of Allan's music (compositional structures, timbres,
etc.) tend not to vary as much as I'd like over the course of an evening's
show. Steve Khan once commented in Guitar Player ('85 or so) that he found
AH's playing to be generally wonderful but "for some reason, it seems to fall
within a very narrow emotional range." IMHO, nobody's got it perfect, though
- there's no single composer, musician, or musical ensemble that has
*everything.* I'm just thankful AH has kept slogging all these years :)
RE: melody. Many years ago I worked with a woman who insisted that the only
music she could stand to listen to was music that had an easily memorable
melody - in fact, she thought that commercials were probably her favorite
form of music. (Honest!) Her brother listened to Holdsworth, and she thought
it was the most horrible stuff she had ever heard; it was all noise to her.
My wife feels similarly, because she can't hear in AH any of the sort of
thing that she defines as "music." But I listen to, say, "Hard Hat Area,"
and I hear melody *all over the place.* Ditto Torn's "Polytown", where it's
even *less* apparent than in AH music. So, to some extent, melody is in the
ear of the beholder. In fact, the reason that I love Holdsworth and have
little or no time for most other "legato distortion" guitarists is precisely
because of (what I perceive to be) the appealing melodical content of his
music, solos included. Now, Mark, is that because of my accumulated
listening experience, or is that because Holdsworth's music stimulates some
part of my brain that's hard-wired? My guess is that both are involved -
aren't there some psychologists who are beginning to look at how experience
actually modifies the structure of the brain?
(Jeff, I'm getting deja-vu here, didn't I make essentially this same post
back in '93 or something?! It's been a while - I forget these things ;)
Kingsley
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I ========= End of Atavachron Digest =========
\ :::: ]I[ :::: /
: ::::::: ]] [[ ::::::: : Administrative requests to:
::: ]] [[ ::: listserv@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
''::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::''
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ ::: Postings to:
::: =a=t=a=v=a=c=h=r=o=n= ::: atavachron@msuacad.morehead-st.edu
::: ]]] ]] [[ [[[ :::
,,::]]]]]] ]] [[ [[[[[[::,, For more info, send HELP as first
::: ]] [[ ::: line in e-mail to the listserv above.
: :::::: ]] . [[ :::::: :
/ :: ] ::: [ :: \ All opinions expressed herein are
I I those of the individual contributors.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tour Dates for Japan, Australia and more are available!
finger preston@msuacad.morehead-st.edu for the most current itinerary